Electrical Short

[Conrad]

Hey guys, I was hoping someone could help me with an electrical issue that I seem to be having.  A few months ago, I was idling my bike to run down the last of the fuel in the tank before I put it away for winter and it suddenly died.  I checked my fuses, and both the main fuse and the signal fuse were blown.  I got replacements for both, thinking it was just a fluke, and tried to replace them.  As soon as my main fuse touched both leads, it popped  :(.  I've tried searching other posts for info on what to do, but not being able to find much coupled with the fact that I do not know very much about the electrical system has me pretty stuck at the moment.  Any ideas? 

[Re-Vision]

Yeah, pull all the fuses and then re-insert the main fuse. If it blows let us know, if it doesn't blow then re-insert the other fuses one at a time until a fuse blows or your bike is back to normal (install the signal fuse last). You might visually inspect your electrical wiring before doing this procedure, being careful not to correct any short you might have. We want to find and fix your problem rather than have it reoccur at a later time.     BDC

[Conrad]

Yeah, pull all the fuses and then re-insert the main fuse. If it blows let us know, if it doesn't blow then re-insert the other fuses one at a time until a fuse blows or your bike is back to normal (install the signal fuse last). You might visually inspect your electrical wiring before doing this procedure, being careful not to correct any short you might have. We want to find and fix your problem rather than have it reoccur at a later time.     BDC

Just tried that, main fuse blew immediately.

[Re-Vision]

Before installing a thirty Amp Main Fuse, Disconnect 4 Pin connector from regulator/Rectifier as well as the 3 Pin Ignition Switch Connector. Install 30 Amp main fuse and see if it blows, if not, reconnect connectors one at a time and determine which one causes Main Fuse to blow.     BDC

[Conrad]

Before installing a thirty Amp Main Fuse, Disconnect 4 Pin connector from regulator/Rectifier as well as the 3 Pin Ignition Switch Connector. Install 30 Amp main fuse and see if it blows, if not, reconnect connectors one at a time and determine which one causes Main Fuse to blow.     BDC

Looks like I'm out of fuses at the moment, I'll give that a shot once I have time to buy more.  Probably Thursday...  Thanks for your help.

[Re-Vision]

If you have access to a Digital Multi-Meter, we can try to isolate your short without the waste of fuses. Look for pinched Brown wires under the seat.     BDC

[Conrad]

If you have access to a Digital Multi-Meter, we can try to isolate your short without the waste of fuses. Look for pinched Brown wires under the seat.     BDC

My friend has one I can use, but I'm not really sure what to look for...  Like I said, I'm not very good with circuits.

Edit:  Only saw one brown wire under my seat, didn't see anything unusual going on.

[Re-Vision]

Get it and we can attempt to teach you a little bit about meters and circuits. I'm sure you'll be a good student and with the help of other Visionaries perhaps we can be adequate teachers. What we will be looking for is whatever is causing a flow of current in excess of thirty Amps ( Current is equal to Volts divided by resistance in Ohms). In a circuit that uses twelve Volts, the resistance to thirty Amps is around .4 Ohms which is close to a dead short. Practice using the Meter to measure resistances if you have anyone to show you how, if not we can start there if necessary.     BDC

[Conrad]

Get it and we can attempt to teach you a little bit about meters and circuits. I'm sure you'll be a good student and with the help of other Visionaries perhaps we can be adequate teachers. What we will be looking for is whatever is causing a flow of current in excess of thirty Amps ( Current is equal to Volts divided by resistance in Ohms). In a circuit that uses twelve Volts, the resistance to thirty Amps is around .4 Ohms which is close to a dead short. Practice using the Meter to measure resistances if you have anyone to show you how, if not we can start there if necessary.     BDC

That would be awesome.  I'll have time Thursday start poking around, and I'll let y'all know if I find anything.

[Conrad]

Unfortunately I didn't end up getting a chance to check the electrical situation before spring break started, and I won't for at least another week now...  In the meantime, I was hoping someone could help guide me through what to look for exactly, and how to use the voltmeter.  Much appreciated.

[Re-Vision]

Before we can get started, need to know more about your Meter. Analog or digital readout, auto-ranging or manual readings. Do leads have alligator clips that can be connected to them. Do you have access to resistors like what you can find on an old circuit board? A picture of your meter would be of benefit.
What are we looking for? With battery disconnected and fuses removed from fuse box, we will be measuring resistance from each fuse clip (the fuse clips that are nearer to the front of the bike) to Ground (Frame of bike) looking for a very low measured resistance between front side of fuse clip of Main fuse and Ground. My bike measures infinity and doesn't have any problems I'm aware of. Head Fuse measured 214Kohms, Signal Fuse measured 2.0 Ohms, Ignition Fuse measured 729 K Ohms.      BDC

[Rikugun]

Access to resistors?  :o Yikes, now I'm scared!  :)

A 30+ amp short doesn't just happen while the bike was idling without some underlying cause. Is there anything you've forgotten to mention that might be of diagnostic value? Any recent changes, additions/modifications done? A recent spill? Add a charger or heated gear harness? Prior to this had any running issues emerged? Charging issues?

[Re-Vision]

Just wanting to know that he can handle his meter.

Access to resistors?  :o Yikes, now I'm scared!  :)

BDC

[Conrad]

Before we can get started, need to know more about your Meter. Analog or digital readout, auto-ranging or manual readings. Do leads have alligator clips that can be connected to them. Do you have access to resistors like what you can find on an old circuit board? A picture of your meter would be of benefit.
What are we looking for? With battery disconnected and fuses removed from fuse box, we will be measuring resistance from each fuse clip (the fuse clips that are nearer to the front of the bike) to Ground (Frame of bike) looking for a very low measured resistance between front side of fuse clip of Main fuse and Ground. My bike measures infinity and doesn't have any problems I'm aware of. Head Fuse measured 214Kohms, Signal Fuse measured 2.0 Ohms, Ignition Fuse measured 729 K Ohms.      BDC

It has a digital readout,  manual readings, I believe.  It does have alligator clips.  I don't have any resistors unfortunately.  Ok, that doesn't sound too difficult.  I'll give it a shot when I get back to my bike.  Thanks!

Access to resistors?  :o Yikes, now I'm scared!  :)

A 30+ amp short doesn't just happen while the bike was idling without some underlying cause. Is there anything you've forgotten to mention that might be of diagnostic value? Any recent changes, additions/modifications done? A recent spill? Add a charger or heated gear harness? Prior to this had any running issues emerged? Charging issues?

Only thing that I can think of is that the battery doesn't charge very well while riding.  Other than that, nothing had been changed recently with the bike.

[fret not]

That could be ANY part of the charging circuit.  (stator, RR, wires and connections, battery, ign. switch, etc.)  Start eliminating the possibilities and the last one will be the culprit.

[Rikugun]

Before installing a thirty Amp Main Fuse, Disconnect 4 Pin (i.e the one with the red and black) connector from regulator/Rectifier as well as the 3 Pin Ignition Switch Connector. Install 30 Amp main fuse and see if it blows, if not, reconnect connectors one at a time and determine which one causes Main Fuse to blow.     BDC

This sounds like a practical place to start. If the main blows, you've significantly narrowed the potential problem areas. If it doesn't blow, you are one step in the right direction.

[Conrad]

So I'm at my bike right now, trying to figure this out.  First off, when I check the resistance on each of the fuse connectors, it keeps bouncing around.  Second, coming from the r/r there are four wires, but after the connector there are only three...  Is that a problem?

Update:  Cleaned fuse connectors, now it turns on...  Except the headlight doesn't work now.  Is it possible it was just a bad connection?

[Re-Vision]

So I'm at my bike right now, trying to figure this out.  First off, when I check the resistance on each of the fuse connectors, it keeps bouncing around. Try connecting Meters' red Alligator Clip to the Black Alligator Clip and wiggling the leads, should read .0 Ohms steadily. If not you have poor connections on your red and black leads. If readings are stable then make sure you have clean contacts when reconnecting to the bike frame and fuse leads. Second, coming from the r/r there are four wires, but after the connector there are only three...  Is that a problem?No problem, all of them are that way.

Update:  Cleaned fuse connectors, now it turns on...  Except the headlight doesn't work now.  Is it possible it was just a bad connection? Bad connections don't usually blow fuses, does your bike start now?

Let's stay on track and fix the fuse problem before we worry about the headlight.     BDC

[Conrad]

So I'm at my bike right now, trying to figure this out.  First off, when I check the resistance on each of the fuse connectors, it keeps bouncing around. Try connecting Meters' red Alligator Clip to the Black Alligator Clip and wiggling the leads, should read .0 Ohms steadily. If not you have poor connections on your red and black leads. If readings are stable then make sure you have clean contacts when reconnecting to the bike frame and fuse leads. Second, coming from the r/r there are four wires, but after the connector there are only three...  Is that a problem?No problem, all of them are that way.

Update:  Cleaned fuse connectors, now it turns on...  Except the headlight doesn't work now.  Is it possible it was just a bad connection? Bad connections don't usually blow fuses, does your bike start now?

Let's stay on track and fix the fuse problem before we worry about the headlight.     BDC

I'm just confused because none of the fuses are blowing now.

[fret not]

There is a fuse in the headlight bucket.  Check that too.