newbe needs help

[redtr4]

Hello out there.. just picked up a 82 vision which looks to be in real nice shape, only 8 K miles.. I have restored prob 20 bikes in last 10 yrs so kind of know what im doing.  I did some initial checking on this bike and it has spark and decent compression.  Tried to at least get in to run on gas in float bowls by removing tank (want to clean it) and squirting gas into gas line. Is there a second vacuum switch in conjunction with the accelerator pump?  Seems like gas wont flow directly into the bowls.  and if I shoot lil starting fluid in carbs most I get is a backfire.  Any suggestions? Also, I have manual on order but is there any place that you can download an owners manual on line?? thanks much!!

[Rikugun]

Unless one of those 20 restorations was a Vision you have not been properly readied for restoring a Vision!  ;D  Just kidding. Sort of....

Seriously, getting the carbs sorted is probably the biggest challenge with these bikes. If you have spark and compression, getting the carbs cleaned and adjusted will get you the rest of the way. Or at least to the point where you can address all the other model and age specific restoration work that's required.  ;)

There is a Mikuni vacuum pulse pump on the carbs but no other vacuum valves that would impede fuel flow to the carbs. If you connect an elevated pony tank to the fuel line, fuel should flow through the pump and fill the carbs if the inlet valves (needle/seat assy) are free and functioning. But even if the bowls are full the passages and jets may not be. You got signs of life with starting fluid so I'd suggest getting into the carbs and give them a proper cleaning or two.

Welcome to the site and I'm sure you'll find all the support you need to get your Vision up and running.  :D

[Rick G]

Visions and there carbs  have confused many professional mechanics. They need to be surgically clean and you  need to know the ins and outs of them . They are Mikuni's version of a Weber carb . No slide , no diaphragm. Its all done with vacuum and pressure. . If you need help send me a PM.

[cvincer]

Remember that if the engine is not running, fuel won't flow into the carbs (from pony or actual tank) .... unless the petcock is in

the 'PRI' position.

[Rikugun]

Remember that if the engine is not running, fuel won't flow into the carbs (from pony or actual tank) .... unless the petcock is in the 'PRI' position.

This makes little sense as the OP states the tank is removed from the bike. What good will putting the petcock on prime do? I used the term "pony tank" to mean an auxiliary tank. I've seen the term used here but don't know if it's universally used or understood. Sorry if you misunderstood.  ;)

[redtr4]

Thanks for your suggestions guys.. did try squirting fuel into fuel line but seemed to back up soon as line to pump filled up.. your saying it should flow thru pump to bowls with no added pressure? I tried sticking longer fuel line into glass jar so could observe.. when I cranked motor the fuel pulsed a little in the line but it did not draw the fuel in.  I assume it should have.. correct? Is there way to check the amount of vacuum at cranking speed to see If it is at specs? thanks for any more help!

[Rikugun]

I'm not sure that fuel "squirted" (how BTW?) has sufficient pressure to run through the pump and into the carbs. I often use the plastic body from a turkey baster as a funnel/reservoir to test run small engines.  Remove the squeeze bulb and insert the small end of the tube into the fuel line. I'll have some gas in a Ratio-Rite cup and fill the bowls up - you can see when they're full because the fuel level will stabilize in the baster tube. The carbs will not fill if the inlet valves (needle/seat assy) are stuck closed. They may also be stuck open in which case the carbs will leak from the overflow feature when the bowls are full and you continue to add fuel.

Even this may not provide the flow needed to pass through the pump. You may need to remove the pump outlet hose and fit the baster tube to that line going to the carbs effectively bypassing the pump. The engine will run for several minutes like this. You'll see the fuel level deplete in the tube and can refill from your small container prior to the level reaching the rubber hose.

Ratio Rite cups are super handy around the shop BTW and you'll find lots of uses for them. They have a spout shape that is designed for pouring. They're designed for measuring 2 stroke oil ratios but also have volume graduations in CCs and ounces making them great for measuring/pouring fork oil for instance. I routed my carb drain hoses where I can sit the cup on the ground under the rider peg, loosen the carb drain screws and neatly empty the carbs into the clean cup. Then it's a simple matter of pouring that gas back in the tank full of treated gas. Doing this after a ride where I know the next may be in a few weeks, guarantees an easy start when the bowls are refilled prior to the next ride.

[redtr4]

Thanks for added suggestions... was thinking bout going directly to the carb inlet hose but the way its configured it looks like would need to remove the fuel pump given the T shaped fitting that connects the carb inlets and the pump doesn't look like it can be easily removed w/o possible damage to an inlet fitting... do you concur with that or am I missing some easy step in removal? one other question the vacuum hose that "powers" the pump is the one directly beneath the pump and runs to the front intake manifold boot.. correct? when cranking over the engine should you feel some suction on the hose that leads from pump to petcock? thanks again..

[pullshocks]

Yes, disconnecting the t fitting at the pump is not very accessible and you do not want to damage the t fitting.
For what you are trying to do, disconnect the t fitting at each carb, and try to fill them individually.

It is 99.99999999% certain you will need to dismantle the carbs and clean.  Open up the fuel pump at the same time.  I found quite a bit of crud in the fuel pump my first time through.  But  I wouldn't think a complete blockage would form at the fuel pump.  More likely to be stuck float needles

Good luck.  Perseverance furthers.

[Rick G]

Remove the float bowl  drain screws and be sure there is fuel in the bowl . If the needles are stuck there will be  little or no gas in the bowls.

[The Prophet of Doom]

I have manual on order but is there any place that you can download an owners manual on line?? thanks much!!

try here...
http://ridersofvision.net/rovforum/index.php?topic=12221.msg111223#msg111223