Paint work nearly done

[wolfman]

Well the paint work is nearly done.  Just some rubbing compound and polish work and then whatever I decide for graphics and I'll be ready to put it all back together.  Some lessons learned to help those who may decide to do their own paint work.

First and formost, if I had it to do all over again I absolutely would NOT use laquer.  NEVER have I had a more tempermental finicky paint in all my life.  It worked GREAT on the METAL tank and FIBERGLASS fairing, but was nearly impossible to get to stick or give a tolerable finish on ANY plastic (side covers, fender, seat trim) pieces.  After I was finished, (including ruining 1 front fender and completely painting and then resanding the side covers TWICE because of paint adheasion issues) I thought to talk to the guy who has repaired my cars (body shop) in the past.  I mentioned my problems and he immeadiately asked WHY I was using LAQUER? (It is apparently nearly impossible to get it to stick to plastic...the secret?..use plastic bonding  ENAMEL as PRIMER) I mentioned that I had heard that enamel should not be used on bikes because it is not gas/fuel additive proof.  He LAUGHED and said "Yeah, maybe back in the 60's it wasn't"  He pointed out (obviously) that if modern enamels were not gas proof, every bike and car on the road today would have the paint stripped off the tanks and below the fuel doors when owners overfilled the tanks...He could not remember the last time he used laquer on anything but furniture...

You CAN use the old paint for primer!  Just be SURE to rough sand it with 150 sand paper and completely degrease and dewax it (there are spray products to this, Castrol Superclean and Lestoil also work well.)

You CAN paint right over the old vinyl graphics with decent results, and use the barely visable lines for guides when applying graphics back over the new paint in the factory locations. (Do not "agressively" sand the old graphics, just rough them up with the 150 grade sandpaper as with the paint.

Well, thats the important stuff anyway, anything else, feel free to ask...

[Lucky]

I painted my bike last year (fairing & tank) and used laquer.  I stimk at bodywork, and because I wanted it to come out right, it took me most of the summer..that's ok.
on the tank, I didn't need to repaint it, just buff it out, but the wide gold graphic stripe did need to be painted back on.  later when I put gas back in the tank, some spilled on it and just took the new paint with it like it was water colors...

I cleaned off the paint from that side, but left it on the other side, hopefully it just needed time to cure..  if not I'll just use some gold decal they have at pepboys ...or enamal.
--Lucky

[JaBey]

Enamel vs. lacquer is kind of a college basketball rivalry. I've just always used lacquer, but both are good types of paint depending what you expect from it. As for every bike and car on the road being enamel...that's just ridiculous. Most all new vehicles are painted with different types of hybrid paints. The types of paints you have to have a license to use in general population. Lacquer works fine on plastic as long as you use the proper sealers in your primer. Some plastics are a lot more porous than others and you simply have to put a non-porous base surface on it before you apply the thin topcoat. It has the same effect as putting glossy paint on non-sealed wood. It looks like you colored it with crayons.

Bottom Line - I recommend anyone that does their own paint to research, research, research everything you can get your hands on about painting before you start. Most importantly, ask the guy at your paint store what he recommends for your particular application before you buy the paint and primer. Your research will support or destroy his opinion....but it's his job to know. Your surface prep is just as important as your final surface. The end result will only be as good as your prep job. Happy Sanding ;D

[Rick G]

Were you using a compressor and cup gun or  spray can?

If your using a spray can,  use laquer , I have not found  anything else that will work that comes in a bug bomb.
if your using a  cup gun, use any of the modern paints . BUT be warned, some of them do etch from gasoline contact and some the clear coat will not hold up from gasoline contact.
I'm not sure what went wrong for you, I painted many bike with bug bomb laquer , plastic and metal and it stuck very well. Ocassionally , it will blush , form high humidity , but that can be corrected.
Last summer , when I painted my bike , I bought a clear that was labeled laquer , but when the first drop of gas hit it and I wiped it off the clear wiper off too and ruined the finish . My mistake ! I should have bought the same brand clear as the paint I was using.

[wolfman]

It was (is) ?Duplicolor spray can laquer "Victory Red" and "Clear"

Worked easily and perfectly on the primered tank (non-Duplicolor primer) and over the rough sanded and dewaxed/degreased (but NOT primed) fiberglass Fairing upper and lower pieces, and was a freaking nightmare on all the plastic side pieces and front fender (crackling) All pieces were painted in the same room, under the same atmospheric and temperature conditions. ?Of note: It was very inconsistant on the plastic pieces sticking well in some areas and actually crackling or literally removing the paint underneath it (primer or old factory paint that had been rough sanded) despite the fact that the pieces were all treated the same across their entire surfaces. ?I tried everything imaginable (different primers, no primer, different cleaners..etc..etc..) until my bodyman steered me in the direction of the sealing Enamel primer and one little trick that seemed to help, which was drying the paint (and warming the surface) with a hairdryer ?quickly in between coats. ?The finish on the tank and Fairing (4 coats color, 3 coats clear) will probably only need very minor rubbing and wax after I let it cure a while. ?The trim plastic pieces and fender are going to need major finish sanding, rubbing out and buffing. ?Guess I can't complain too much though, the whole thing has cost about $100 total at this point, and looks fine...though I have yet to purchase the graphic vinal. ?Probably do that this weekend if I can find the right color...I thinking either Gold or White.

[Rick G]

I always use the same brand primer,paint and clear and I only paint in the summer , when  temp and humidity are more predictable, I used duplicolor too,  a metelflake blue. The fairing is white.

[Sable]

I am currently working on my gas tank... see link below for the progress (updated site today). I followed the same procedure with the tank that I have done with the following items on my bike: front fender, both side covers, under seat rails, rear fender and radiator cover. I am painting this "new" (to me) tank so it will match the rest of the bike. As I have said on my site, I strictly use Dupli-Color primer, paint and clear coat. I have had no problems with this combination of paints and primers. They have always been great. I do use Klean-Strip Prep-All to degrease and clean the items before the primer and before the base coats.

[JaBey]

wolfman...something in your last post hit me in the head like a hammer.:)  I made the assumption you were using actual painting equipment. Spray can laquer sucks man! I would NEVER recommend doing bodywork painting with spray paint. You can never achieve the same professional finish as the type of painting a bodyshop does with spraypaint. I also promise you, your buddy at the bodyshop does NOT use spraypaint. The paint you buy from a professional automotive paint supply store in a pint or quart can to be applied with a psneumatic paint gun (preferabley HVLP gun) has one thing in common with spraypaint (a.k.a. rattlecan, bugbomb, shakeball), that is that they are both applied wet....that's about it! With a spray gun, you control the thinness of the paint, the translucentcy, the hue, and the spray pattern, of top quality paints that do not smudge from petrol.

Just wanted to let you know most of the differences we discussed are apples and oranges. Anybody who likes doing their own bodywork...I recommend investing in a good HVLP paint gun and a good sized air compressor. After your first paint job, you'll be glad you did. Candy Apple translucent smoke tones don't come in spraypaint...hehe!

[Rick G]

While all you have said is true, many of us don't want to spend the money on equipment we may never use again, or pay a professionals  rate on a 22 year old vehicle.
When I started as a wrench, in 1964  I had experience as a bicycle mechanic and part of that discipline was paint in tradei-ins . Schwinn made a great range of laquers (since discontinued) that we used to match their stock colours.
I applied my bug bomb painting skills to trade -in motorcycles,  many times te results  were indistinguishable  from stock bikes (some were pretty fancy!)  
So , while professional painters may scoff , I (and I suspect many others) have turned out many  very presentable paint jobs. There are a wholely different set of skills involved .

[JaBey]

Don't get me wrong Rick...I use spray laquer on just about everything besides bodywork. Hell I spray laquered some leg blocks for a player piano I'm restoring the other day. But spraypaint is in most cases indistinguishable on bodywork for a temporary amount of time. It fades and smudges fast. The more you wash it, the more defects it takes on also. In many cases, it is so thinned that a single compound of it will take off the paint. Worst of all is how very easy it is to chip it. Modern paints in an spray gun have none of these charactoristics. It was just beat in my head that "a job worth doing, is a job worth doing right!" I KNOW DAD, I KNOW!!! hehehe ;D I send out for powder coating anything else (frames, batteryboxes, ect...) For the record...I only recommended people who like that kind of work to purchase the equipment. All of that is readily rentable.