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Started by per_w_aberg, December 01, 2013, 06:21:04 AM

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per_w_aberg

#20
I've looked at Kehini and they certainly look good. The range is plentiful and availability is good  for parts,  used and new carbs. The jetting knowledge is at hand. What can go wrong? Anyone with a tip on carbs for from some bike to use?

per_w_aberg

#21
Today's adventure was cleaning up the front wheel. The spare disk mounts made my eyes sore. No my hands are sore instead.

fret not

That is one method of staying warm while working on your XZ.  All that elbow grease will make you stronger too. ;)
Retired, on the downhill slide. . . . . . . . still feels like going uphill!

per_w_aberg

#23
That's true. My time is abundant, money are not and the lack of tools is going to give me elite fitness by spring.

per_w_aberg

The gas tank question. Replacing the tank.

I picked up a Yamaha Dragstar 650 gas tank that has the right shape and a tunnel wide enough to fit with some adjustment. I also tried a SX750 gas tank that's got a tunnel wide enough. The XS tank is rather popular on different builds. Now none of them fits the bill, The 650 one is to wide and the XS is funny looking to me. Gas tanks with wide enough tunnel for the XZ is rare so perhaps these findings is of use to somebody. I'm back to square one with chopping the original tank I think.

The Prophet of Doom

Not many people I recall have different tank shapes

Chimera made a tank out of fibreglass
http://ridersofvision.net/rovforum/index.php?topic=8027.0

Dingleberry beat up on a GS550 tank
http://ridersofvision.net/rovforum/index.php?topic=14851.msg136225#msg136225

Jared on Kiwibiker used a tank off a different style GS but didn't say what
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/142215-Cafe-Racer-XZ550



Rick G

Unless you want to  communicate  to the NZ boys who have adapted Weber to the vision, stay with the stock setup  Pods do not work , unless the are inside the stock air box, with a functioning flapper door ( preferably the vacuum operated one)   I have a VX 800 Suzuki , which has  34 mm  constant velocity carbs, the front one is a down draft type  and could be adapted to the XZ550. The rear is a side draught type and so you would need  two fronts. If you need a pic I can provide one.
Rick G
Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there in lurks the skid demon
'82.5 Yamaha XZ550 RJ  Vision,
'90 Suzuki VX800, 1990 Suzuki DR350.
'74  XL350   Honda , 77 XL350 Honda, 78 XL350 Honda, '82 XT 200 Yamaha, '67 Yamaha YG1TK, 80cc trail bike

QBS

Rick if, as you say, it might be possible to adapt two front VX800 carbs onto a V, how really feasible do you think it could be?  What size are those carbs?  I would think that a CV design would solve a lot of problems and really improve driveability.  Your additional thoughts please.

per_w_aberg

Good links on the gas tanks, thanks. The frame is back from UCC. These guys are the shit! Simple design and killer welds. The thought it funny that lots of Japanese bikes use 1 inch tube for the frame, as do this one. The continued with that size. Moving the front shock mount down will make the spring clear the seat/tank. I'm 6.3 feet tall so I guess I'll reach the ground :) Maybe I'll just have to give the bike to my wife.. 

Craig B

Yep i tried the pod filter thing too and was very disappointed with performance, in fact was lucky it even fired up. Wanted to get rid of that bulky black box myself. I was thinking if i could construct a butterfly valve to go between pod and carb to replace the flapper. Or maybe like the R1's you could put a butterfly valve in the exhaust chamber.

per_w_aberg

Whats the deal with the flaps? Never heard of another bike that used them. Are they there to compensate for badly designed carbs?

The Prophet of Doom

Do a google - air box flappers are on many sportsbikes made in the last 30 years

The vision sounds brilliant with POD filters but making it work well would be more complex than just ripping the airbox out

Rikugun

Quote from: per_w_aberg on December 13, 2013, 02:42:35 PM
Whats the deal with the flaps? Never heard of another bike that used them. Are they there to compensate for badly designed carbs?
Sadly, yes.  :(  ;)
It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is then to persist in delusion, however satisfying or reassuring.  Carl Sagan

QBS

I wouldn't say that the carbs are badly designed.  Rather, just misapplied.

Rikugun

Perhaps. Maybe the carbs are better suited to applications where RPMs don't vary much - like a trash pump or lawn mower.  :)  :) LOL, just kidding. They're great, really. No they're not.  ???  :)
It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is then to persist in delusion, however satisfying or reassuring.  Carl Sagan

per_w_aberg

Damn! Been reading up on air boxes and they have come a long way. They are now tuned resonators with variable resonance frequency adding potentially 10-15% more power. The flaps are there to aid low rpm. Even the exhaust systems are now variable (Triumph 675) with a butterfly valve aiding to low rpm power. It's in the neighborhood of acoustic speakers. Running without a well designed air box might be just like running speaker drivers without the box! Since my project is primary a design project to keep me busy i discard the air box problem for now certain that it will at least look good, start, and work at full throttle :)

QBS

Excellent dialog.  Thank you all.

The Prophet of Doom

Rikugun, normally you are a little more reasoned in your discussions than this.
What exactly is it that makes these carbs badly designed opposed to set up poorly?

Re-Vision

Please excuse my butting in.

Quote from: ProphetOfDoom on December 14, 2013, 07:10:33 PMWhat exactly is it that makes these carbs badly designed opposed to set up poorly?

If the carbs are difficult to clean, hard to keep clean and tuned, then they are either a misapplication or poorly designed for motorcycle use. Thousands of Visions coming to an early end due to carb problems testify to this.

BDC

per_w_aberg

Took time of the carb debate and chopped and beet the original tank. The design choices is  hard work. I feel it strongly when a bike looks proportional good but what exactly is it that's does it? If the balance of a bike is not OK it doesn't matter how well done the details are, on the contrary, the effort is wasted in my eyes.  I'm going to challenge myself on this question for a while and try not to get tangled up in construction details. This is how fare i got. One of my favorite trackers are this Mule one.