Blake's build thread

[Blake]

Most of you may not know/ remember me.  I've been around since the late 90's on and off. and pretty much disappeared since the late 2000's when i got distracted building up a drag car.   After 17 years of ownership, I'm finally throwing in the towel and giving up.   I've been eyeballing later model Buells (09 XB12r to be exact) for the past couple years, and my significant lady told me "You already have bikes! No more until that one in the corner is done or gone!"  I took a few days, thought it over and finally came to the only real conclusion I could.

Time to once and for all replace all the things wrong with the vision!  I've had lots of ideas over the years of what I wanted to do with it, but finally decided I just need to get my stuff together and get this thing running and rideable.  The big important ($$$) bits finally came in the other day, so i figure it's a good time to start a build thread.  I like doing a thread simply because it keeps me honest and gives me a reason to stay on track.

I'll keep this first post updated with a running list of changes/updates, etc. So hopefully it'll help others who want to change things around.  Once I get the bike running i'll be more than happy to post the ECU settings for fuel and spark in this post also.   I need to start going to all my notes and lists i've made of what i've done to the bike and put it in one spot (here, hopefully).

CLICK HERE FOR HIGH RESOLUTION PHOTOS

IGNITION/ ELECTRICAL SYSTEM:
   ECU: Microsquirt v3
   Coils:  GM LS2 truck coils-
   Wires: MSD 8.8mm
   Plug caps:  MSD
   Plugs: NGK BKR
   Reg/Rectifier:

FUEL SYSTEM::
   ECU:  Microsquirt v3
   Throttle bodies:  2001 Triumph 600tt 38mm
   Injectors: 2x Precision flow 30397-1 LS7 type 39lb/hr injectors
   Fuel Pump: Walbro 255lph inline pump
   FPR: Aeromotive something (have to find the the box)
   Gas tank: underside replaced with 18ga, sides modified, ¼"npt outlet,

COOLING SYSTEM:
   Thermostat: NTC W01331634599NTC 170* Thermostat
   Radiator: HONDA TRX450R 04-09 ATV Radiator
   Radiator fan: 8" Ebay special
   Coolant return splitter block: Ebay dual 1/2"npt in, 1/2" npt out, with 5/8" hose barbs
   Coolant hoses: 5/8" and 3/4" silicone hoses
   Coolant tubes from thermostat to cylinders: removed, replaced with
   
EXHAUST:
   

[Blake]

So I've given myself until May to get this thing running again.  Hell or high water, I will be riding this bike this summer.  First and foremost i'm just getting it running and rideable.  Overall, not really much to do- fab some brackets, run some wires, that's about it.  I've spent the past 6 years rebuilding my drag car, and this is about 1/10th the size, so it shouldn't be too hard.  Honestly the hardest parts i see right now are welding on the bottom of the gas tank (its completely cut out right now) and fabricating a new seat subframe.  Those are maybe 1-2 days a piece if i have a clear weekend.  It's too cold and late to go into the garage right now, so I'll just throw up some pictures here for now.

Bike in its current state (I took everything off so i could clearly see the frame)


Mocking up tank positon and new tail.  (from 2002-2003 Yamaha R1)


Microsquirt and the harness came in yesterday.  I'll get a better picture later:


Throttle bodies  (These actually will be the easiest to mount/ make a connection to the motor)


And various other bits I've accumulated.  Starter relay, power relay, new R/R from modern honda, wire connectors, rearsets, steering damper, thermostat, bar end mirrors, etc.



I spent a little time outside today, and with microsquirt finally coming in, i need to modify the wiring harness i made a few years back (OEM one is a mess), and run the new fuel injection and ignition wiring.  That means first on my plate of things to do asap is remount the tail, since all of the electronics will be housed in there.  I'm hoping i can pick up some 1" tubing this week and then next weekend weld up the new subframe.

Quick question though for anyone reading this.  Can anyone tell me the compressed (coil bind) length of the 82 shock?  I need to know how high the tire can possibly go, so i know how low i can mount the new seat.  I dont have a spring compressor handy to disassemble the shock to measure, so i was hoping someone else might have a shock with spring removed handy?  You'd be  my hero for the day.

[fret not]

Do you have to install any sensors for the Microsquirt system?  I have thought of fitting a fuel injection system but they are pretty complicated to make them operate efficiently.  Throttle opening, air speed, air temp, cam position, Oxygen sensor in the exhaust, etc.

I look forward to this thread and your progress.

[Re-Vision]

I measured an 82 shock with spring still on. From top to bottoming-out point was  67 cm. From bottom to top of shock cylinder was 207 cm. For a total minimum length of 274 cm from center of top pivot point to center of bottom pivot point.          BDC

[Re-Vision]

This seems to me to be a really worthwhile project, don't hesitate to let me know if I can help in anyway.            BDC

[Blake]

Do you have to install any sensors for the Microsquirt system?

In regards to sensors, you only need 4 for fuel injection with this system:  intake air temp, coolant temp, and manifold air pressure.  The TPS is built into the throttle bodies im using.  I'm using regular GM sensors for the coolant and air, and for the map sensor i'm using a small MAP sensor chip that the ECU manufacturer uses for the full-size versions (like the one i have on my car).   However, most important is in regards to the ignition.  You used to have to figure out a way to bolt on a 36 toothed trigger wheel to the crankshaft.  Somewhat recently though, there was an ECU change that allows this compact version to do an off-set/dual ignition input.  So now it simply can use the bike's stock ignition pickups to tell the ECU when both cylinders are at top dead center.

here's the link to the info for the dual spark setup:  http://www.useasydocs.com/details/dualspark.htm

For a total minimum length of 274 cm from center of top pivot point to center of bottom pivot point.

Thank you!  That's exactly what i needed to know!

[QBS]

Blake, Thank You!  Do well sir!

[Blake]

I had to run in the garage and measure the map sensor so i could find a box it will fit in, so i snapped a few photos:

Regular ole' GM air and coolant sensors.  3/8"npt is a pain, but their output is easy to setup, and they're cheap.


And here's the new fuel/spark ecu along with the new R/R for size comparison.



Your regular ole' GM ignition coils (word is these trucks ones are the "most powerful" so why not use them?


And here is the manifold pressure sensor i need to put in a sealed box.  quality ones are $60+.  The sensor itself is $15, and is about 1% accurate (very good).

[fiat-doctor]

Very nice Blake...   I've built and installed Megasquirts on a few cars and it's a great system...  the Vision should be a perfect candidate...  will be watching closely...  best of luck,
                                                                                                             Steve

[The Prophet of Doom]

Also watching with interest.  I was running out of things to do on my Vision and have a huge surplus of cash. NOT

[fiat-doctor]

Oh, I forgot to mention....  Saturn coolant temp sensors are 1/8 inch pipe and the same resistance/temp curve as the big GM ones..  snag one at your local wreckers and the connector as well..  Steve

[Blake]

Oh, I forgot to mention....  Saturn coolant temp sensors are 1/8 inch pipe and the same resistance/temp curve as the big GM ones..  snag one at your loca

Ohhh really?   Thanks for the tip!  I'm definitely going to have to find one of those.  3/8 npt is a bit too unwieldily for the bikes size.

[Blake]

More parts rolling in.

Here's my coolant splitter. dual 1/2" in, single 1/2" out.  Measuring the engine and radiator, it seems the engine outlets are about 5/8" ID hose, and the radiator inlet is also 5/8" hose.  I have a few 1/2"npt to 5/8" hose barb connectors coming also.  If i can get that 1/8" npt coolant temp sensor, it should screw right in to this splitter at the plug you see.



I also picked up a hydraulic clutch conversion.  It's cheap chinese junk, but i should be able to fix it enough to work.  There was a company that sold them for XS650's that look like he just resold them and doubled the price.  I'll give it a go through and smooth things over.  It'll be interesting to see how well it works.

Example of how it works:  http://www.hughshandbuilt.com/2012/03/14/xs650-hydraulic-clutch-conversion-install-instructions/



New throttle and bar end "lane splitter" style mirrors.  I think i'm going to clamp the mirror on at the very end vs inside the bar itself.  There's something else I possibly want to mount at the very end.


Also, does anyone need exhaust port crush gaskets?  I think i have a little more than a lifetime supply now (100 to be exact)

[Blake]

Just did a quick couple things today.  I ordered a couple universal weber carb arms so i can connect the two throttle bodies.  The weber slot is ever so slightly not "long" enough.  A few minutes with a small file and I got both fitted.
 

Im not sure how the angle differences between the two arms is going to affect the front cylinder opening.  Not sure how much i like it's current state.  I'm trying to avoid having to grind off the other side of the throttle shaft on the rear throttle body, because its peened on and there is no bolt to hold it.  In other words, its going to be a major pain in the butt to reattach the weber arm.


Also I found a small project box i had and did most of the work to contain my MAP sensor inside of it.  I'm about to order a couple standoffs to raise the sensor off the floor, and center the tube outlet, so i'm waiting to drill that hole until after it comes.  The passthrough is a simple waterproof gland.  I'll solder some 18ga wires to the sensor, pass those wires through, then put an actual connector on the outside of the box.



I really want to start on the wiring (since that's the biggest part of this whole project), but I need to have the seat somewhat mounted in order to properly and cleanly run the wires.  I might temporarily rig the seat on until i can get some proper 7/8" tubing for the subframe.

[fret not]

Blake, those arms look simple enough that it should not be toomuch difficulty to make a 'new' one to fit at the correct angle.  Or cut the arm off and have it welded on at the correct angle.  It's only metal, after all. ;)

[The Prophet of Doom]

Im not sure how the angle differences between the two arms is going to affect the front cylinder opening.  Not sure how much i like it's current state.  I'm trying to avoid having to grind off the other side of the throttle shaft on the rear throttle body, because its peened on and there is no bolt to hold it.  In other words, its going to be a major pain in the butt to reattach the weber arm.

Could you bolt a piece of material on one arm to allow a new mounting point for a link arm?  The new hole will follow the same arc.  I might look a bit too fugly though

[Blake]

Hmm.   You guys had me doing a search this morning for adjustable throttle arms and I came across this:  http://www.dellorto.co.uk/page/85/?s

That disc (2nd down) seems like it would be ideal.  When I get home later I'll have to measure and see if it would fit.   I'd go ahead and order 2 of those (for a similar look), but looks like it would be almost $60 shipped over from the UK.  Thanks for the idea!   I might have to find some scrap metal and make a couple....  Plus I think I like the multi hole disc idea for fine tuning.

[jefferson]

You may be hurting your Hp potential with the openings of the throttle bodies being so close together. The suction in one cyl could have an effect on the other cyl. Is there a reason you aren't going to mount them as the stock vertical mount carbs?

[fret not]

Blake, does the Microsquirt ECU replace the TCI box that is stock on the XZ?  Or do they run in conjunction?

[Blake]

Blake, does the Microsquirt ECU replace the TCI box that is stock on the XZ?  Or do they run in conjunction?

Yes, microsquirt replaces the TCI box.  You can adjust the timing curves, spark duration, run higher power LS2 coils, etc.  Remembering how many headaches I had with both the carbs and my TCI boxes (I think i'm on my third), really was the determining factor to just get rid of it all and put some modern technology into it.

You may be hurting your Hp potential with the openings of the throttle bodies being so close together. The suction in one cyl could have an effect on the other cyl. Is there a reason you aren't going to mount them as the stock vertical mount carbs?

As of right now they're just sitting there until I can get a better idea of their positioning.  The 1/2" aluminum plate i ordered to make the flanges just arrived, but i also need to add some pipe above that to give myself enough space to drill a hole for the injectors.  Also at this point i'm not 100% certain if i want to build an airbox (which i will actually have to put some thought into), or just run pod filters again.  If I go pod filters, the throttle bodies will definitely need to be angled.  In all honesty, my first idea was to have the two throttle bodies facing almost parallel the ground like a roundslide carb would be mounted.  This would free up a ton of space above the engine for the fuel pump, filter, electronics, etc. to go. Who knows, it could actually still happen.  We'll see how things go as the build progresses.