1983 getting 11.96 volts

Started by WGuaire, December 30, 2019, 05:16:34 PM

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fret not

Nice new stator!  Did you replace and stake the starter clutch bolts while it was open? :police:
Retired, on the downhill slide. . . . . . . . still feels like going uphill!

WGuaire

No. Didn't really know about them. Got a picture?

fret not

here is a mental picture: the starter clutch is attached to the inside of the flywheel with 3 socket head bolts that come from the inside, through the starter clutch, and thread into the flywheel.  The factory used bolts that are just a bit too short but they center punched their ends to distort the threads so hopefully they would not loosen by themselves.  FAIL

You need bolts that pass through the starter clutch and flywheel and protrude by a couple threads.  This exposed part of the bolts is what you need to peen over (mushroom)so they can not just back out and loosen by themselves.  In future repairs to the starter clutch it would be necessary to use a die grinder or Dremel tool to remove the distorted ends of the bolts, then they can be removed as usual.

If left at factory setting there is a distinct possibility that the starter clutch can work loose, rattle, bang, and jerk shortly before it lets go.  The ensuing damage usually entails elongation of the bolt holes, which basically ruins the flywheel unless you don't need the starter, and possible fracture of the starter clutch.  Usually when this happens there is a rattling noise and clunks that get worse as the parts deteriorate, but this noise seems to go away when the engine is revved.  If you hear this noise your  flywheel is already damaged but might yet be saved. :police:

Starter clutches are currently available as they are used on other more recent bikes, flywheels are not.
Retired, on the downhill slide. . . . . . . . still feels like going uphill!

injuhneer

I read in another thread where on ROV'r rotated the clutch by 60* to drill/tap new holes for the starter clutch. I am guessing that flywheel was not beyond repair.

As I read that post I was thinking that a Helicoil or similar would provide another method to save a flywheel.
- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

injuhneer

Quote from: WGuaire on January 18, 2020, 11:41:17 AM
Mike - It's the European 750. Years about '93 to 2003. I did my search for the year 2000.

My USA eBay __
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Stator-Magneto-coil-Fits-Honda-XRV750-Africa-Twin-1993-1994-1995-1996-1997-2003/392410321194?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Thank you. I ordered one and it should be here later today. Tomorrow will be the installation.

- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

WGuaire

Some of the Chinese sellers ship through a place in the US. Mine shipped from Texas.
The best R/R that i have found, I get from roadstercycle.com.

injuhneer

#26
The ordered stator arrived.

I believe I am going to add something to it. I see that the wire is coated as it should be. I also noticed the complete absence of a conformal coating on the wire at each pole to immobilize the wires. Over time vibration encourages wear at the contact points of the wires. In the olden days stator or rotors were not only wound with coated wire but often had layers of glass or polyester fabric included. This was to prevent the wear and dampen vibration. In later years the conformal coating method became prevalent. Now they don't bother with either.

I will add a conformal coating to the poles on the stator to immobilize the wires. This is especially needed for the wire runs between the poles on the obverse side.

I'll have to go research which class (I think class F is dielectric and good to 325*F) and type to use. In the meantime I can fit it and get the connector ready.
- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

WGuaire

I made use of the male/female connectors and connected the 3 stator wires to the white plastic connector. My Reg/Rec got the male side of the white connector. I simply snapped them together. If I need to change or remove a component, it's unplug and detach.

injuhneer

#28
I pulled the cover today. Of course there was blue RTV everywhere.  ::)

After cleaning up the RTV mess I found the gasket was damaged and the thread of the case were stripped in one hole. After disconnecting the harness the cover  was cleaned up and the old stator removed. It was completely toasted on the reverse side. It is a wonder it generated power at all.

After fitting the new stator I made a few measurements. The stator core is about 4mm thicker than the OEM. That puts the screw heads that hold it 4mm closer to the flywheel/rotor. If someone has added longer bolts for the starter clutch this stator will put the screw heads close to the protruding bolts.

Of course the seals on the OEM stator leads were molded on. I am cutting a few layers of 1/8" BUNA-N to make new seals.

I ordered a new 11H-15451-11-00 gasket. In the meantime the seals will be made and the stripped hole repaired.
- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

injuhneer

#29
I have to say that the routing of the stator and sensor wires is a little nonsensical.

Considering the oil levels and the pulsations in the crankcase as well as putting the molded block seals on the wiring it is, well, silly. An egress point a bit higher would make more sense.

Since the new stator has a sleeve to cover the wires I'll use it in combination with a grommet sliced in half to make the other part of the seal. It appears that the crush will be enough to seal it all up.







- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

injuhneer

Quote from: WGuaire on January 25, 2020, 02:05:03 PM
I made use of the male/female connectors and connected the 3 stator wires to the white plastic connector. My Reg/Rec got the male side of the white connector. I simply snapped them together. If I need to change or remove a component, it's unplug and detach.

I had purchased some connectors that fit the SH775 regulator so I'll use those but keep the 3 way spade connector just in case. Who knows when it may come in handy.
- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

The Prophet of Doom

#31
Remember that the oil is under a fair bit of pressure. You'll probably want to seal up the end of the sleeving as well as the insides of the grommets. 

On the XZ400 I drilled out the stock bungs, threaded and sealed the new wires with Yamabond - worked a treat.  Unlike normal "heat/oil resistant" RTV, Yamabond 4 maintains its integrity in hot oil and holds pressure.  Amazing stuff and well worth the price.  About $25 a tube.

jefferson

Something that will help stave off leaks is to get the wires and grommets the wires goes through as oil free as possible. I ended up filling the cavity between the 2 grommets with Yamabond.

injuhneer

#33
I appreciate the advice.  :D

I don't have any Yamabond. Maybe the dealer nearby does.

I do have a variety of Permatex aviation sealants. I think the #3 will do the job (and cleans up with alcohol later).

I agree that the sleeve and grommets will need sealant. If I were a bit more patient the cover would make a nice mold to cast new parts.

I do intend to add o-ring sections to the grommet grooves to provide additional sealing surface.

- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

The Prophet of Doom

Quote from: injuhneer on February 01, 2020, 12:27:28 AM
I don't have any Yamabond. Maybe the dealer nearby does.

It's way cheaper on ebay than any dealer.
Buy yourself a tube.  if you don't like it, I'll pay for it

injuhneer

#35
There are 3oz tubes of Yamabond 4 on Amazon for under $10 USD.

The gray ThreeBond is another I have used in place of Yamabond with success. It worked nicely as a case sealant for the Vmax crowd.

And a great idea about cutting the wires then drilling the bungs for re-use. Of course that raised another question for me. If the area needs to be sealed why use a fabric covered wire that will (eventually) wick oil past the seals? Maybe they thought we would clean and detail more than ride?   :laugh:



- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

jefferson

I think Three Bond 1104 is the same stuff. I've used it before with success.

injuhneer

I can report that the Africa Twin stator fits and works.

After wiring in the stator to the SH775 regulator the engine was started and voltage monitored.

At the battery the reading steadily climbed (at idle) to 13.6-13.7vdc. After warm-up revving to ~2000 RPM the reading climbed to 14.8 then bounced between 14.5 and 14.7 (lo/hi, L/R signals, brake light).

- Mike O
1982 Yamaha XZ550RJ

WGuaire

Quote from: injuhneer on February 10, 2020, 08:24:43 AM
I can report that the Africa Twin stator fits and works.

After wiring in the stator to the SH775 regulator the engine was started and voltage monitored.

At the battery the reading steadily climbed (at idle) to 13.6-13.7vdc. After warm-up revving to ~2000 RPM the reading climbed to 14.8 then bounced between 14.5 and 14.7 (lo/hi, L/R signals, brake light).

Good news on the fitment.
  My 3 wire connector was a problem. It didn't make good enough contact, causing heat, causing melting of the connector body. I cut it out and directly connected the 3 stator wires to the 3 R/R wires. Much better now! The Mosfet from Roadster Cycle has a disconnect anyway at the R/R.
  The fuel tank is on the left in the pic. An Eastern Beaver fuse panel is showing.


auto

What made you think and try a Honda Africa twin stator?