help with fixing the starter.

[dj]

Thanks Tiger!

TIGER IS AWESOME!  TIGER IS AWESOME!  TIGER IS AWESOME!  TIGER IS AWESOME!  TIGER IS AWESOME!  TIGER IS AWESOME!
Hopefully this doesn't make his head to big.  ::)

[Night Vision]

hmmm, I forgot what a strong magnet the flywheel is.... I'd feel all around the backside of it. I'm assuming that you haven't taken the flywheel off because this was a "starter" project.

you may try tipping the bike to the left when it's up on the center stand,,, rock it back and forth,,,, shake it  ::) to see if it's in the "oil pan" (too bad it doesn't have an oil pan huh?)

I think I'd also pull the spark plugs out, put the bike in 5th. gear, and roll the real wheel forward to make sure you don't have any internal interference.....

I think everyone's main concern is that the gear rod isn't inside your engine.... >:(

[dj]

Night Vision - I'll have to put the clutch lever and clutch handle back on the bike.  I had to take them off to be able to get the left side engine cover off, but I'll definitely try the 5th gear and rear tire trick.

No I haven't taken the flywheel off.  After fixing the starter and then the bike not starting I thought that there might be something wrong with the starter clutch, that is why I had the left side cover off.  Everything in the starter clutch appears to be working properly.  The bolts aren't backing out and there has never been any noise that is associated with the starter clutch needing to be fixed.  I was checking to make sure that the gears were all spinning properly (only one way).  I'll also check behind the flywheel again.  I can turn the flywheel by hand (read with a ratchet on the nut) and there isn't any resistance in the engine other then the normal resistance one the uppermost and lowermost point of the piston movement (I think this is what is happening, although I don't know if I am describing it correctly).

I am hoping that we don't have another bad series of T-storms like we did last night.  I really want to check this thing out and see where it could have gone.

[Lucky]

you won't like this...:
you didn't need to pull the cover to see if the clutch only turns one way, you could have pulled the starter & done it from the hole... sorry..

when you do find it, your gonna have one hell-of-a 'Caps-Lock' post!! ;D

--Lucky

[dj]

 >:( Why did you have to move half way through my fix?  I couldn't ask you the "proper" way of checking the gears while you were "offline" during the move. ;D

[dj]

i tried putting the bike in 5th and moving the rear tire.  With the clutch in it will turn, but with the clutch out it wont turn.  Is this the way that it should be??

[Tiger]

i tried putting the bike in 5th and moving the rear tire.  With the clutch in it will turn, but with the clutch out it wont turn.  Is this the way that it should be??

dj.....Did you remove the SPARK PLUG'S.... ???

[dj]

I guess I missed that part of the explanation.  No, the spark plugs are still in it.

[Tiger]

 :) Then take the wee bugger's out bonny lad.... ::)

[dj]

okay here is the next question.  What size spark plug wrench do I need to get the plugs out?  I'll see if I can find it in my manuals.

[haunter]

18mm

[Tiger]

okay here is the next question.  What size spark plug wrench do I need to get the plugs out?  I'll see if I can find it in my manuals.

The right size  ;D ;D :D ;)....18mm

[dj]

thanks guys, I'll have to stop at the parts store on the way home and get some metric tools.  I can't believe I haven't had to take off anything that would require a wrench/socket yet!  I never thought about the fact that all of my tools are standard and not metric. :-[ :-[ :-[

[dj]

I got the socket and tried to take out the spark plugs, but didn't have a 3" extension so I couldn't turn the ratchet enough to make it catch.  So back to the parts store for the second time.  I got the spark plugs out, shifted up to 5th gear and tried to turn the tire.

IT WONT BUDGE WITHOUT PULLING ON THE CLUTCH CABLE!  Does this mean that the rod is in the engine somewhere?

[QBS]

Only turn the tire in the direction of its' normal rotation.  Most engines don't do reverse rotation very well.

[Night Vision]

also......

are you sure you're in fifth gear? just because you lift up on the shifter 4 times and hear 4 clicks does not mean you are in fifth.....

when you are in the top gear, you should be able to lift up on the shift lever and hear.... nothing

you may have to roll the bike around or move the wheel back and forth to get there.

the reason I said pull your plugs and put it in fifth is because you should easily be able to roll the bike or wheel and see if you have any crunchy sounds....
guess you could also turn the crank with a wrench and get same result... I just thought it would be the best way to make sure your not hitting rods or jamming gears without a teardown  >:(

[dj]

The tire turns with a lot of resistance.  It will resist the turn for a while and then it will turn freely for about an 1/8th of a revolution, then resist and I'll have to pull hard on it and then it will turn another 1/8th of a turn.  I can get the tire to turn all the way around, but it is only and 1/8th of a turn at a time.

I'll go make sure that it is in 5th.  I am pretty sure that it is, but I'll double check.

[dj]

I don't hear anything for metal on metal noise.  The only sound that I hear is the sound of the engine chugging over as the pistons move up and down.  It is still giving a lot of resistant.

Could the resistance be becaue there hasn't been any oil in the bike for about 3 weeks while I have been trying to work on the starter?  Would this make the pistons harder to move up and down, and how do I see it that is the issue without putting oil back in the back?  I don't have the gasket for the left side cover yet, it is on order but hasn't arrived at the dealer yet.  I would rather not have oil leaked all over my driveway.

[Night Vision]

what you describe about engine turning over (chugging) and some resistance (compression) is what I'd expect

I'm -edit- (almost) out of suggestions as far as telling if that rod slipped into that oil return. I don't know what else I would do (except find that sob rod).

unless someone else has any other suggestions...... I guess the call is up to you.

are you comfortable enough that the rod isn't in there?

You do have a couple of days to see if anyone else has any ideas... if you're waiting for a part from Tiger... that'll take at least a week or more (no fault of Tiger... mail sucks)

one last suggestion... when you do get the rod... see if it would actually fit in the oil return passage.... WITHOUT DROPPING IT IN THERE  >:( >:( >:(

[dj]

Where does the oil return go to?