RR problem...again :(

[Stuman]

Hi. Today my RR (form tdm850) on my V burned up. Again! :'( I check the entire system with a multimeter and that was the finaly diagnose. There is no continuity between stator wires and engine ground and there is continuity between each of the three stator wires >>> stator is ok! But the charge DC is unstable. Over 6000rpm = 14.5V, 3000-4000rpm = 12.5 - 13V. I think the problem is in the RR.  :'(
I have a good offer for a new Vmax RR. Is it works on my XZ properly? 7000km with the TDM one i do not have problems. It charges stable 14.5-14.6 until todays heat...40C...  :'(

Regards!

[Coil Coyle]

Stuman,

           Any R/R you use will need air flow the voltage sensing wire well connected to the positive and a clean negative connection.
$0.02
;)
Coil

[Stuman]

I think it has got a good air flow... ???

[Coil Coyle]

Stuman,

           I think so too.

           Semiconductors also just die after cosmic ray bombardment.
:P
Coil

[Stuman]

hahahaha...the reason is not in the RR or stator...haha...my battery is totaly dead!  ;D :D YES!  :D I am so happy!  ;D

[QBS]

  "there is continuity between each of the three stator wires >>> stator is ok":  Please correct me if I'm wrong.  However, I don't think you want continuity between any of the stator wires and anything else.

[Lucky]

Please correct me if I'm wrong.  However, I don't think you want continuity between any of the stator wires and anything else.

There should be continuity, not much though.  Test specs, according to Electrex are 0.5 - 2.0 Ohms

hahahaha...the reason is not in the RR or stator...haha...my battery is totaly dead!    YES!   I am so happy! 

WHY is the battery dead? You cannot test any charging system properly with a dead battery.  if it's low on water then it's overcharging.

charge the battery if you can, or replace it if not & re-run the Electrex tests.

--Lucky

[Stuman]

The water level was on max. Now i am charging it and the moment of true will be tomorrow when it is done.  ::)

[Coil Coyle]

  "there is continuity between each of the three stator wires >>> stator is OK":  Please correct me if I'm wrong.  However, I don't think you want continuity between any of the stator wires and anything else.

QBS,
        The stator windings are wound in a triangle circuit, called a Delta. The ohms between each pair of the three wires should be equal. Then no connection from any wire (they are all connected together in the delta) to the case or iron stator core. A megohm tester is the proper way to test the windings isolation from the grounded parts of the bike but an ohmmeter will tell if there is a gross failure to ground.

$0.02
;)
Coil

[QBS]

Thanks for the clarification.  Usually V stators don't give us a chance to make much of an early subtle pending failure diagnosis.  They just go straight to crispy critter.

[h2olawyer]

Thanks for the clarification.  Usually V stators don't give us a chance to make much of an early subtle pending failure diagnosis.  They just go straight to crispy critter.

Ain't that the truth.  My last one went from charging fine (14.5+V)  at one glance of the gauge to fried (12.5V) within a couple minutes.  The one before that made the gauge bounce erratically for about a minute before it fried.

H₂O

[Stuman]

guys...the stator is burned up. That is the final diagnose. Now i will replace it and i think to put a oil cooler. What do you think? Is it a good idea...oil cooler? The only think i want is a working charging system not for 1 year and then again replace the stator...  ??? I thin the oil cooler will help me to erase this sickness of my V.

Regards!  ;)

[Lucky]

The oil cooler i designed seems to be working well, & as an added bonus, i have a really hard time pushing the temp guage past 1/2 way, even in this 105 degree heat.

i still have plugs & instructions ava.

--Lucky

[h2olawyer]

I purchased one of Lucky's plugs, but as yet have not had the fortitude to go drilling the engine block to install the cooler.  I was just going through one stator per year - but this year, I've put more miles on & have already eaten two.  This time, I went through all the ground connections and cleaned them up - even though they looked nice & shiny before I cleaned them.

I'm thinking its vibration at this point.  Maybe my starter clutch bolt fix changed the balance of the flywheel just enough to get it into vibrating at just the right (or wrong) frequency to cause the stator to short out internally after a short time.

H₂O

[Lucky]

I'm thinking its vibration at this point. 
H₂O

H2O,
do you happen to remember me posting about a weird buzzing sound i had in the stator case after changing a stator, that drove me nuts for a long time?

if you remember i had changed the stator mounting screws to hex bolts. even though the bolts were tight upon instalation & the stator seemed tight, when that one died & i went to take it out, i happened to notice, just by chance that i could move the stator ever so slightly, just with the clearance in the mounting holes.

the solution was to simply add one washerunder the head of each bolt. (i used lock washers)

are you still using the stock screws or have you changed to something else?...
food for thought.

[h2olawyer]

I've still got stock type screws.  They are not OEM, I got them from a local specialty fastener store, but they have the same measurements as the OEM screws - they're just a little harder.  The OEM screws are really soft.  Replaced them on the second stator, so I don't think they're the problem.

I can't hear anything odd - it's just some seat of the pants failure analysis.  All of the failures have been initially an internal failure to the stator frame.  A couple had significant crispified insulation.  One of them - either the Rick's or Electrosport - had all the insulation literally melt off the stator & re-coagulate at the bottom.  Wildest thing I've seen in stators so far.  I have also noticed on the latest fried stator that there is the top of one post that is blackened in a narrow band & the winding on that post shows some deformation.  No crispy insulation, but for the first time, I experienced stator / R/R plug melting - on just one wire.  All connections are now high quality crimp fittings with integral shrink tubing.  Got them from Tiger.  They seem to be much higher quality than traditional crimp fittings.

I'm just wondering if my stator clutch fix or something else may have unbalanced the flywheel by just enough to set upeither a very high or very low frequency vibration.  I sure don't hear or feel anything out of the ordinary. 

This OEM used stator fits on the case really tight.  The others have been snug, but not as tight as this one.  I had to carefully press it on and keep it straight.  If it got off kilter, by even a little bit, it wouldn't go any lower.  Took me a good five minutes to get it on & seated before reinstalling the screws.  I had to make sure the holes were lined up before starting to install it as it would not turn in the case once it was fully seated.  Yes, I had to install it twice.   ::)

Also, I've always had charging gremlins in every vehicle I've ever owned.  I seem to go through alternators more often than I should.  Don't think it's an odd magnetic field around me since I don't have any problems with wristwatches.

Also, battery was new a couple years ago.  Sealed, maintenance free Interstate.  Lives on the Battery Tender Jr. all the time when I'm not out riding.  Had Interstate check it out last week & they said it acts just like new.  So, that's been eliminated as a possible source.  I've used three different R/Rs and they all test within specs.

H₂O

[Lucky]

i think the vibration noise i heard was just luck, doesn't mean i'd hear it again under the same circumstances...

the replacement bolts i used were the same standard metric length (whatever that is, i forget) but just manufactured a few hundrethes off & like i said, it was just luck i found it, could have been that running it wore the stator mount holes just enough to allow me to be able to move it when it had to come out.

anyway a few .03 washers are cheap insurance next time.  and if you have a spare rotor, swap 'er out...

[h2olawyer]

If anything, the new screws I used were a thread or two shorter.  I'm positive that's not the problem.  If this stator dies, I'll go for the flywheel swap.  Just need to go get the bolts to do another starter clutch fix.  Both my replacement flywheels still have the stock bolts in them.

I have another part I'm awaiting from Yamaha.  It will require draining the oil again, so I may do it then.  That Cometic gasket sure makes pulling the cover an easy, quick project.

H₂O

[Lucky]

ok, good, just wanted to rule it out.