Suspension upgrades

[QBS]

JoeV, I really enjoyed reading your comments, especially your feelings that the V didn't have much in the way of handling deficiencies with exception of the ridiculous (read:cost cutting) ball steering head bearings.

My personal experience ('83V) is much the same.  Two particular incidents really stand out.  One of them involved a very attractive stretch of nicely paved straight road that I had just discovered but never ridden before.  Seeing as it was very rural and had no traffic, I began a speed run.  I was passing through 80 mph with WOT when I discovered that although the road was well paved and straight, it had some serious undulations.  As soon as I realized what I was into, I cut the throttle and lightly posted on the pegs.  Meanwhile, the forks were bottoming out twice in quick succession...bam..bam.  I prefer a plush ride to scraping pegs so the air forks were pressurized to 6 psi and the OEM mono shock was set to max rebound dampening and lightest spring preload.  The steering head bearings were caged rollers and the fork seals were and are OEM.  I estimate that the bike had about 50k miles on it at the time.

I can't speak for others, but I'm pretty sure most riders would say that if you're bottoming out you're forks at 80, you're probably fixin' to have a bad day.  My V never twitched or showed any sign of instability throughout the entire event.  The OEM forks seal do not leak to this day and they still hold their 6 psi of air for years without leaking down.

Needless to say, this event really impressed me and greatly increased my confidence in the bike.  So much so, that a couple of years later, I was getting air at 100 mph in the Texas Hill Country.  The suspension was set as before and I had discovered another long, straight, well paved rural road.  Except, this one was obviously a roller coaster.  So, I decided that it would be fun to make down hill speed runs to see how fast I could get the bike up to.  However, it seems that I misjudged how close the crests were together when you're cruising at 100 mph.  When I topped the first hill, the bike left the ground under perfect control and lightly landed on it rear wheel shortly thereafter.  I was so jazzed about doing this that I kept on going and jumped the next two hills also.  Then I turned around and did it again.

I was a little younger and crazier then and, given a similar opportunity, might not do such a thing again.  But, then again, depending on how I felt at the time, I might.  I know the bike would be ready.  It's things like this that really bond you to the V.  But with all respect, there's the distinct possibility that the Lord, not I, was in control on those days.

Back to V rear shock improvements, it seems to me that the best option for improved rear suspention lies in the method pioneered by Extent (I think.  Please forgive if I'm wrong).  His modification opens a whole range of shock applications and requires no permanent modifications to the bike.

Cheers to all.

[jasonm.]

The 82 XZ550 is 12.5" long
The 83 XZ550 is 13.5" long

The 84-85 RZ350 is 11.5" long and for a linked suspension so I'm not so sure that would work so good.

On SmokeBomb, I have a single clicker (on the remote reservoir) Fox Shox that I got rebuilt... Kenny has the same. It's a good shock but I believe the clicker adjusts only the compression, not the damping (rebound)

The problem, as Glen and others found out, is the 12.5-13.5" length.... there's not a lot of other good shocks that are that length.... Triumph does seem to be the closest match, Ducati might be a touch short, but again, these modern shocks are designed for linked suspensions so I don't know if their travel and spring rates would be compatable... Glyn seems to like his.

Then you get into eye diameters and mounting widths.... Glyn has worked around that.

The last I saw, a Works Performance shock, like Joe V's was $350.00
Wilbers makes a kickazz shock for maybe $550-$600?

A group buy on the Wilbers would be more feasible than Fox, so it seems... but I don't invision a lot of ROVers willing to put a $600 shock on their $500 Vision  ::)

Night Vision, I put an '83 shock on my '82...they are the same length. I don't know where the difference on 1" came from....they are the same length eye to eye ! But I have seen different lengths available from "Works Perf."

[Extent]

I don't really think I've done much of note suspension wise.  I did run with a 636 shock on the rear for a while, but I'm certainly not the first to do something like that. 

The basic measurements that I did for the shock adapter are good, but I want to wait till I have a more accurate way of machining the spacers and such before I put it all back on (hacksaw and cheap-o drill press left things not quite perfectly straight)  replacing the lower bushing with something properly sized for the Vision mounting hardware I think would be pretty important (rather than my crooked drill job)

[Night Vision]

Night Vision, I put an '83 shock on my '82...they are the same length. I don't know where the difference on 1" came from....they are the same length eye to eye ! But I have seen different lengths available from "Works Perf."

I stand corrected... I went back into my freezing garage and checked them again... The 82 shock was set on the highest preload and the 83 the lowest... when I set them the same... yes they are the same length... duh  :P

[tben]

JoeV: I have XS650 emulators from Mike's in the mail. I'll be putting them in and replacing my for seals as soon as it comes.

[jasonm.]

Night Vision, I put an '83 shock on my '82...they are the same length. I don't know where the difference on 1" came from....they are the same length eye to eye ! But I have seen different lengths available from "Works Perf."

I stand corrected... I went back into my freezing garage and checked them again... The 82 shock was set on the highest preload and the 83 the lowest... when I set them the same... yes they are the same length... duh  :P

See, I wouldn't mislead you.

[joevacc]

JoeV: I have XS650 emulators from Mike's in the mail. I'll be putting them in and replacing my for seals as soon as it comes.

Great. I hope it's marked improvement!  Keep up posted.
jv

[jasonm.]

I put an '83 shock on the '82 I had(shouldn't have sold it!). Kept me from getting thrown off the seat on the big bumps and dips. The '82 shock has NO rebound damping at all! I still have that shock on the shelf with only 5k original miles on it...better for a dune buggy than a 'cycle.
  I keep my '83 damping set on "4" .

[tben]

Before I was accustomed to my '82 shock I nearly got launched into oblivion going over a speed bump. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I'll find an '83.

The Cartridge Emulators came two days ago. I have been dissasembleing them and figureing it all out as best I can. What I've gathered is that it has adjustable damping but the rebound is the same as stock. They have an free flowing rebound valve so rebound is controlled buy the stock holes in the forks.

[kwells]

can always change your viscosity

[Cdnlouie]

Yes, it's the compression damping where the problem exists in the old damping rod forks.  The emulator valve allows for letting more oil get by when you hit a sharp bump, lessening the jolt from the wheel compression and delivering more compliant suspension.  The rebound works the same over a sharp bump or a soft undulation as it has the same compression rate (the spring) pushing on it regardless of a quick compression or slow compression.  It makes sense that it would be set up that way.

I am very interested in seeing how this works out for you tben, so appreciate the info you are sharing.  I would like to get my hands on a set of these myself.

CDNL

[tben]

If it works it was a steal for $50 at mike's xs. I haven't seen Race Techs emulators in person but the machine work on this looks good.

[Paul@Sheffield]

Has anyone tried these. http://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/HagApps8.htm
I am thinking of using Hagon for the rear monoshock and for front progressives.
Paul

[Night Vision]

you won't find too many folks here that have an aftermarket shock.... there are a few, but I don't think anyone has a Hagon...

you can search here for lots of info on just about anything you ever wondered about

www.advrider.com

[Lucky]

Don't forget the fork brace people, that's a must have upgrade.
  now, if only we could find some....

[joevacc]

Has anyone tried these. http://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/HagApps8.htm
I am thinking of using Hagon for the rear monoshock and for front progressives.
Paul

I researched them because i understand that they are a much higher quality than the Works Performance shock that I ended up with.  If I remember correctly they do not have a unit for the Vision.  I don't think I asked them about price for a limited run but I did go into it with Ohlins and they were talking $1500/ unit. (I do not cheap out with my V but that is over the realm sensible)
Tell us if you can get any info out of them.

Ciao for now,
jv

[Night Vision]

joe, they list the XZ.... around 255 pounds / $500 .... FOC (free of charge?) shipping in the UK

[tben]

Don't forget the fork brace people, that's a must have upgrade.
  now, if only we could find some....

Does anyone have a line on these? I'd definitely like like one but don't know where to look. 8)

[inanecathode]

One could probably get a machinist to fab up a fork brace. Really its just a yoke with caps on the sides...

[dieseler]

One could probably get a machinist to fab up a fork brace. Really its just a yoke with caps on the sides...

I'm going to try fabbing one out of two hub clamps and boxed out sheet metal.  If it turns out well, I'd be willing to make a small run of them for ROV members.