My Vision

[JohnAMcG]

Ok, took a ride, who knows when I'll get a chance again.  While I had it running I put a meter on the stator connection, and was getting between 15 and 20 VAC on any two wires.  I read in Daves FAQ that the stator should be putting out 50 vAC.  My stator passed the continuity and ground test, so what gives?  Weak magnets??  I'm at a bit of a loss.  Anyhow, I have plenty of work to do on it that I know what to do, so, Ill get started on that.  Oh, btw, it started right up, no throttle, no choke. 

[Rikugun]

I think that claimed 50VAC is at 5-6K RPM. At what RPM did you check it? Also, continuity checks with an ohm meter is no guarantee the stator will work under load, especially when hot. Marginal insulation that tests ok with the meter may break down and begin to "leak" voltage to ground when hot and 50 volts are run through the wires.

[Brian Moffet]

There are some AC meters that are tuned to 60 HZ, which you will not be producing.  If you are using one of those, then your readings will be off.  But I would try to verify the RPM first. 

Brian

[JohnAMcG]

Ok, a quick update.  I lost my grandma this weekend, so I have been pretty busy, but still trying to keep at the Vision.  I got the front rotor on, and what a difference it made.  I can stop now.  While doing that, I found the speedo problem.  Somebody bolted up the front wheel without having the speedo sending unit properly aligned.  I bent the tabs back, one of them broke.  It is together now, but I will need a new ring with the tabs, and also the other metal shim type ring is bent.  Anyone got those lying around?  Gonna order a SS brake line for the front, still need a headlight with low beam, and a flasher cancelling unit. 
I figured out the reading were wrong for the stator.  I was at idle, not 6k rpm.  So that should be OK.  I got the front caliper seals, but figure I'll wait till I have the new brake line to install.  This week, I will do the rear brake bolts, and continue updating, cleaning, re-connecting the electrical system.  ALso, I looked at electrex, and they show no stator available for the bike.  Is this correct?  Did they discontinue it?  Or should I be looking under a different model bike.

OK, I am gonna go take a ride. 

Oh, btw, I have a KBC helmet and the visor retaining system broke out of it.  Seems pretty chincy, but I called them and they are mailing me new improved mounts, and a new shield to work with them.  If anyone has a KBC with the old mounts I recommend getting the new ones.  The plastic behind the two screw heads is paper thin, and they will break.  I was pretty upset, it being brand new, but they were so nice on the phone, already had a fix, and are sending it all to me absolutely no charge.  I tried many helmets and this one was snell approved and had the best fit of any I tried on.  After dealing with their customer service, I would recommend this helmet to anyone.   

[QBS]

Getting the lower speedo unit properly installed can be a little tricky.  There are enough parts bikes within our group that surely someone can help you out there.  Stators are available from several other sources beside Electrex.  Archival research should reveal all.

[vadasz1]

Your coming along very well John. 

Condolences to you and your family for your loss.

[JohnAMcG]

How does the saying go?  Announcing your plans is a good way to hear god laugh.

Thanks guys, I appreciate it, but clearly I'm no Jedi yet. 

     She started right up, but died while I was getting my gear together, then couldn't get her to crank again.  I had places to be, but decided to check the voltage drop at the battery while hitting the start button.  Was at 11.2v and dropped to 11.1 while starting.  I suppose that's a little low, but the small drop is somewhat encouraging.  I tried to bump start it, for practice, but I couldn't get it.  There is only a slight grade on my driveway, and I didn't want to have to push it up the hill if I couldn't get it.  Also, there were some dogs that rushed me and seemed like they were in attack mode, and if I were forced to stick one, I'd rather it be on my own property.  It took quite a bit to convince them I was the wrong guy on the wrong day.
     So, now that I have the brake fixed, my #1 goal is to make the thing reliable.  I suppose the first thing I'm gonna do is get an oil seal for the starter.  I'm sure I can find someone local to supply it.  Then I'll see if I need new brushes, and get that all back together.  I'll take off the starter switch and clean it up.  Beyond that, I'm at a bit of a loss.  Before getting on here, I hit the start button after she had been sitting a while, and she cranked right over.  I don't understand why it would act that way.  Well, one thing at a time, but I'd really like to be able to ride the bike somewhere outside of my neighborhood.   

[akvision]

John,
I have a speedo set and the brackets and .......the cables...i think. Would be happy to send out for postage.. if they will help.

On starter seals, search my posts on CR Seals ... i posted the # and info that I found on them.. they are SK seals now.

akvision

[Tiger]

ALso, I looked at electrex, and they show no stator available for the bike.  Is this correct?  Did they discontinue it?  Or should I be looking under a different model bike.

My Condolences on your loss...

Re; Stators...

:) Here is a list of other bikes that use the G7 stator (same as the Vision... 8) )

YAMAHA...

1987-96 XV535 Virago
1988-95 XV750 Virago
1992-93 TDM850

HONDA...

1983-86 VT500c Shadow
1983-84 VT500FT Ascot
1988-01 VLX600-VT600 Shadow
1987-96 XL600V Transalp
1996-99 CBR900RR
2000-03 CBR929RR

SUZUKI...

1985-87 VS700 Intruder
1992-99 VS800 Intruder
1990-92 VX800

APRILLIA...

1999-02 SL1000 Falco
1999-02 RSV Mille
2001-02 RST Futura
2002.... ETV Caponord

BMW...
1997-01 F650

Cut and paste or print off ;)

There are others...feel free to add on to this thread 8)

                    8).......TIGER....... 8)

[JohnAMcG]

AKVision - By speedo set, do you mean the gauges, or the sending unit? Gauges would help, superficially (the bike had been laid down before I got it, the side of the gauge cluster case is damaged and the internal board has a crack), but mechanically it's fine.  I'm really focusing on getting everything to work and becoming a proficient biker before I make her pretty.  What is damaged are the two washer like pieces in the front wheel, between the bearing and the speed sending unit.  The washer piece with the metal tabs that mate with the sending unit, and the race that goes with it.  The race is bent, but I could probably flatten it out and make it work. 

[vadasz1]

AK: I think you mean that CR was bought by SKF.

[Lucky]

if your speedo cable wasn't turning, you probably don't need a flasher canceling unit. 

the caceler is activated by a magnetic switch in the speedo.  the speedo cable drives a bell with a magnet on it inside the speedometer, under the bell is a magnetic switch. 

the canceler counts the pulses from the switch & cancels the flasher at a predetermined interval...

[JohnAMcG]

Yeah, I thought about that too Lucky, I need to check again to make sure, but I have the speedo working now, and I don't think they are canceling at all.  Aren't they supposed to cancel in 10 seconds as well?  No telling how long the speedo will work, the metal of the one tab left on that piece is very stressed, so I'll check it on my next ride. 

[Kevin]

Welcome aboard John. You a coming along fine with your Vision. Everyone here has been through the vision debugging. I recommend pulling out the side stand relay. It can give you grief even with the switch disconnected. If your bike has the oem fuse box replace it with inline fuses or a marine type block.The fuse holder will look shiny and clean but the metal will not have enough tension to make a good connection.

[JohnAMcG]

Side stand relay was cut at the TCI Module as well as the rev limiter. 
Fuses were replaced with inline. 

I was a lurker here for a while before I got approved on the forum and even before I got the bike.  I have spent countless hours reading through these forums, so most of the quick fixes I have done.  I still appreciate the info, I don't want to discourage input, and being totally new to motorcycles, I could easily miss something or goof it up.  On the one hand I don't want to be spoon fed the info and have you guys think I'm another noob idiot, but on the other hand, I am a noob idiot, and need all the help I can get.  Thanks guys.  -JM

[Lucky]

  Aren't they supposed to cancel in 10 seconds as well?

Distance as well as time, that's why it counts the clicks...

[JohnAMcG]

Ok, back from a week in the mountains of WV.  What fun, now back to work

I pulled the started and bench tested it.  It would spin about half the time, and sounded a little rough, so I took it apart, and everything looked good to my untrained but very mechanically inclined eye.  I cleaned everything up really well, put it all back together and now it is consistently spinning when I make contact and sounds much better.  Now, since I have the oil out, I want to get a look at the starter clutch bolts. 

[JohnAMcG]

OK, so next step was the starter clutch bolts.  I pulled the side cover, and pulled the rotor.  Did I mention to you guys that I have every tool I could ever possibly need in my fathers garage.  It was easy with the "steering wheel puller", exactly what is shown in the Haynes.  Anyways, the clutch looked good, bolts were still in there, but they were loose to the touch.  My local hardware had them, 12.9 chrome, so I cut em down put em in and peened them over. 

While I had it out, I looked at the stator.  Doesn't look too good.  I am going to do the diagnostics on it again today.  It was all black, and looked a little flaky.  Some spots were better then others, but I think it is going bad. 

So I put it all together, and put a meter on my battery, and I was only getting about 12 volts at 7k rpm with no headlights on.  My friend pulled up on his bike, and my girl showed right behind him, so, somebody was gonna be mad at me.  I decided to leave her for a few minutes and take a short ride.  Well, lucky she wasn't too mad, because she had to come get me when I died 2 miles away.  I hooked a jump box to it, and used bungee cords to strap it to the back of the bike, and made it home.

I think i need a new stator.  Damn. 

[JohnAMcG]

     Alright, I've had a chance to do some further testing, and here is what I discovered.  I checked the stator AC output at the connector (Yes, I still have the original connector), and I got around 55 vAC at 6k rpm from 2/3 connections, but about 32 from one of them.  Ok, so stator IS going bad, but is that really enough to kill the bike?  Two of the loops are good and one is at 60%.  It still passes the continuity check, but like I was told, that may not hold true under load.    So I test the reg/rect.  and it fails.  I found the connector for it had started to melt.  I pulled the tabs out and hit them with the high speed brush.  There must have been significant voltage drop on that connector, because I after putting it back together, I got 2 more volts across my battery at idle.   Improvement, but back to the R/R.  I understand at this point it may just be idle chatter, but it seemed to pass the tests in one direction and not flow at all the other.  If they are diodes, shouldn't that be true?  It didn't fail all the tests, but If someone were able to tell me what the data actually means, really, just for my edumacation (new stator, and R/R coming in the mail, hence not changing the stator connection yet) I would post them up here, I don't have them handy.  So, I have a jumpbox tethered to the back of the thing, so I can make it to the auto parts store, or my buddies house, and I'm still trying to do something with it every day. 

[QBS]

At the rate you are going and with your good attitude, you'll have the bike well sorted in short order.  Good for you.