Suggested Oil

[cjones]

What type of oil (weight and brands) do people use in their Visions?  I don't really feel like driving for an hour to pick up the suggested 20-40W that the manual suggests.

Thanks!

[Shwuz]

My new friend at the parts counter at the yamaha shop (I'm sure with this vision we'll be getting to be really close friends) was absolutely adamant about not using anything other than yamalube 4 in my vision.  He says that because our bikes have a wet clutch, regular car oil will cause it to slip under load, shortening its life and robbing precious, precious horsepower.  Car oil has a different series of anti-friction compounds, and yamalube is, of course, specifically designed for the serious sportbiker with an always-wet clutch.

Or so my friend at the parts counter says.  For the price difference, I chose to play it safe with the yamalube.

[QQBS]

For the last 31 years of my motorcycleing experiance Castrol 20/w50 has served me well.  My '83 V has 85,000 miles on it, all but the first 3500 with Castrol.  The heads have never been off and it will still red line 5th gear.  The factory clutch was replaced at 77,000 miles.  Cheers.

[Lucky]

i'm with QBS on this one, I also exclusivly use castrols 20W-50
4 stroke motorcycle oil and am very pleased with the results.  my clutch was frozen when i bought my V, (it had sat outside in the New England air for 9 years...) rocking the bike had free'd it up, i've put something like 4 or 5 K on the bike per year, and have never had the clutch cover off...

[hewi]

I absolutely agree with QBS. I?m using Duckhams 20/50w mineral oil and change oil and filter every 3.000 km. I?ve tried lighter oil and synthetic oil but that caused the clutch to slip and also the red oil-pressure warning lamp came on at idle, presumeably because the clutch slip caused the oil to become too warm. I?ve done almost 100.000 km or about 65.00 miles. The rear head gasket blew some thosend miles ago. The head and valves were in prime condition

[Rick G]

HI I used Castrol 20w50 for many years,  But a cycle magazine evaluation of many brands of oil showed it was no longer the best.  I'm trying  Torco T4 20w50, a blend of synthitic and mineral oil. so far shifting is better, and there is no clutch slipping at all. torco is a west coast brand, and a bit pricey. but it comes highly recommended, so I'll continue with it for now.

[Cdnlouie]

Has anyone actually used some of the prevalent synthetic oils on the market and experienced clutch problems?

I cannot see how the synthetic oil would actually contribute to clutch failure.  The oil industry is an interesting marketing place and it seems like it is hard to get a straight answer here.  The old wives tales are also hard to shed.

I just bought my Vision and after a quick oil flush I intend to give some synthetic stuff a try.  Will keep you posted.

[Leather]

I am the wrong guy to ask as my ride only has about 4,500 miles on it AND I know little about  moto performance/racing.  But, for whatever its worth I have used Mobil 1 synthetic in EVERYTHING I own since DAY 1 ... including the "V" starting in 1983 at zero(0) miles.  I hate to find out I'm wrong after all these years but.... the thing has run great with no oil/clutch problems whatsoever.  But the day ain't over ..... ;)

[Cdnlouie]

Ran across a biking buddy that has a Triumph 900 triple with a wet clutch and 100,000km on it. ?He has used Mobile 1 synthetic since it was new and has never had any trouble with the clutch and the engine still sounds really nice after all the mileage.

You know for the price of clutch plates even if synthetic oil does create a problem, the benefit on all the other expensive engine parts would seem to outweigh this minimal expense.

So why bother falling prey to the marketing strategies of oil salesmen? ?Do we really think that they give us all the goods?

[jasonm.]

Just don't buy any oil with that starburst symbol. Which is anything thinner that 10w40. They are missing key ingrediants that our cycles need.

[cogswell]

Thanks for the info Jason.  Do you happen to have any documentation or sources to obtain information on motor oils?  What is the significance of the starburst, I have noticed that on 10w-30 oils?

I also find the diesel oil classification an interesting formulation (15w40).  I often wonder if it is just the particular weight grade designation or are they actually adding or deleting ingredients?

If anyone is in the petroleum industry and can comment it would be very interesting.

One very pragmatic question is this:  Is it better to buy a cheaper oil and change it more frequently or buy a better oil and follow the recommended drain interval?

Will we ever know?    ???

[Lucky]

the The Vintage Triumph Register has a great page on everything you allways wanted to know about motor oil at:

http://www.vtr.org/maintain/oil-overview.html

--Lucky

[Rick G]

Since  business is so slow, at the bike shop I work at , my boss dosen't wan't  to get a case of the  Torco blend I was using, so I'm trying Castrol Syntec Blend  in 10-40 ( for easier starting in what passes for winter here in Oregon)  I experenced some clutch slipping last ride , but that may have been due to  clutch cable adjustment . I corrected it and the problem seemed to go away. I hope to ride tomorrow and see if it has returned . If I remember correctly Jeff Swann stated that he also used synthec oil in his bikes with no clutch problems. My boss feels that synthetic oil will cause oil leaks in older engines but he's nuts about a lot of things, so I would not believe it, unless I see it myself.

[bikeseamus]

 Everyone should keep in mind that the EPA got into the oil business about five years ago and mandated the removal of phosphorous and zinc. These additives were especially helpful in 4 stroke motorcycle oils,due to their molecular shear resistance. Note that all the big four Japanese makers specify motorcycle oil, and can void your warranty if you put car oil in your bike. Valvoline makes a 4 stroke motorcycle oil that has just been released to Auto Zone and other auto stores, for 2.99 a quart. It's the real stuff. Look on the specs on the back of all oil. If it doesn't say it meets or exceeds JASO valve wear specs, and MA, which means motorcycle tranny molecular wear resistance and clutch compatibility,DO NOT PUT IT INTO YOUR JAPANESE 4 STROKE MOTORCYCLE! Install a magnetic drain plug on your engine. They interchange with the rear end plug. When you change your oil, examine what stuck to the magnet. Normal wear will be particles so small as to resemble black paint. Even the best oil filter will let a 10 micron particle pass through,as it must for proper flow. A magnet will grab a single ferrous molecule out of your oil and keep it from circulating and grinding up your engine. Do this stuff and your bike will be happier. That makes for a happier motorcyclist. This is the 21st century,move ahead. You may have decent luck on the old wives tales,pump jockey BS, advice from friends who heard yada yada yada,but everything in the previous paragraph is true in 2003. Ride on

[bikeseamus]

 Everyone should keep in mind that the EPA got into the oil business about five years ago and mandated the removal of phosphorous and zinc. These additives were especially helpful in 4 stroke motorcycle oils,due to their molecular shear resistance. Note that all the big four Japanese makers specify motorcycle oil, and can void your warranty if you put car oil in your bike. Valvoline makes a 4 stroke motorcycle oil that has just been released to Auto Zone and other auto stores, for 2.99 a quart. It's the real stuff. Look on the specs on the back of all oil. If it doesn't say it meets or exceeds JASO valve wear specs, and MA, which means motorcycle tranny molecular wear resistance and clutch compatibility,DO NOT PUT IT INTO YOUR JAPANESE 4 STROKE MOTORCYCLE! Install a magnetic drain plug on your engine. They interchange with the rear end plug. When you change your oil, examine what stuck to the magnet. Normal wear will be particles so small as to resemble black paint. Even the best oil filter will let a 10 micron particle pass through,as it must for proper flow. A magnet will grab a single ferrous molecule out of your oil and keep it from circulating and grinding up your engine. Do this stuff and your bike will be happier. That makes for a happier motorcyclist. This is the 21st century,move ahead. You may have decent luck on the old wives tales,pump jockey BS, advice from friends who heard yada yada yada,but everything in the previous paragraph is true in 2003. Ride on

[timovision]

Thanks everyone for the info on oil to use while running the V.  Does anyone know about winter storage?  Do you all always change the oil before the winter or only if you have significant miles on it.  I only had about 150 miles from my last oil change so I didn't bother changing it before I stuck it away for the winter.  Was that a bad idea?  I hear stuff builds up in the oil while it's sitting but I'm not 100% sure.... I'm paying $7/quart for yamalube so I'm trying to get the most out of the oil without damaging the V.
Cheers.

[motoracer8]

I use mobile1 motorcycle oil in my vision 10/40,40,000+ miles no probblems, no clutch slipping, no leaks. I also have a bmw twin with 162,000 miles on it torco 20/50 sence new.

[bikeseamus]

 Take it from motoracer. His oils read MA on the back. Actually I think MA might be the highest classification commonly available. If it aint there, don't use it. 140K kinda speaks for itself.

[jasonm.]

The zinc and phos. were not removed. Just reduced.  Then friction modifiers were put in. These can make some things in the engines slip that you don't want to slip...aka., starter clutch and main clutch. I have used many brands of all types in many bikes. Now I use Syntec 20w50 and Mobil1 15w50. No problems at all.

[bikeseamus]

 Jason  You're right. Phosphoros and zinc were reduced to negligible levels,and you probably know that Mobil 1 makes a car oil and a four stroke motorcycle oil. The bike oil is OK for bikes, because it says MA on the back. They used to just make one,it worked for bikes. Mobil 1 car oil will gradually make your engine bearings go away,and your cam lobes,and your starter clutch,etc. Driven conservatively,you won't experience immediate problems with almost any decent oil. However, over the long run using car oil in your bike is a real bad idea, and  you aint gotta do it anymore if cost is a consideration. Valvoline released a bike oil last year for 3 bucks a quart that my friend with an oil engineering job tried to torture to death on bike and air cooled aircraft engines. He says it's the best for the buck and about three times the oil for our purposes as Mobil 1 car oil for about 33 cents on the dollar. You do notice that yamalube boldly proclaims on the front of their oil " non friction modified" ?. That's a good thing. My friend said he wouldn't put a friction modified oil in his lawnmower. In a word, it's EPA designed garbage, total trash worthless swill. NO film strength. It's easy to remember that MA stands for motorcycle, and if it aint on there, don't put it in your bike. My friend uses the 3 buck stuff in his 600 HP street Rod that he's got about 50k into. That says something, considering what he does for a living. Ride on buddy.