Riders Of Vision

General => TechTalk => Topic started by: dj on May 18, 2006, 08:09:17 PM

Title: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: dj on May 18, 2006, 08:09:17 PM
The bike started out with a carb issue (which I believe is fixed, but don't know until I can test it!) and now it wont even start.  Ran before the carb fix.  I put the battery on the battery charger for a while (several hours) and put it back on the bike.  It wouldn't turn over, but the solniod in line with the battery would click.  After trying to jump start the bike hooking it up to the car now the solnoid wont even click over let alone try to turn over the ignition.  I have checked every electrical connection that I can find and cleaned them.  I haven't been able to find any breaks in the lines, burnted out lines, etc...

What could be going on with it to make it not turn over?  Any suggestions would be greatly helpful.
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: QBS on May 18, 2006, 08:17:05 PM
Faulty starter motors don't crank engines.
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: dj on May 18, 2006, 08:19:39 PM
okay, what does the starter motor look like and where do I find it?  Also how do I check to see if it is working?
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Lucky on May 18, 2006, 08:47:41 PM
You need a 'starter rock' lol

first, i hope the car your jumping it to wasn't running. NEVER jump a bike off a running vehicle.
are you jumping it correctly?: pos to pos, both vehicles, neg on car at battery, neg on bike to engine or frame good ground point (no paint). not to batt neg.  this must be the last clamped hooked up.

Starter could be full of oil, try tapping it with a hammer (don't whack it!) the starter is on the bottom front of the engine, behind the ft exhaust pipes & below the radiator.

how old is the battery? it may just be too dead to charge.  hard to start even by jumping.

--Lucky
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: dj on May 18, 2006, 08:54:27 PM
Lucky,

     No, the vehicle was not running.  I know better then that.  The voltage coming out of a running car/truck is going to be around 14.* something volts and is to much for the battery of a bike to handle.  I put the neg clamp from the cables on the chassis on a non painted portion.  I got sparks when I put it on so I am pretty sure that it was a good conection.  I don't have a voltmeter yet, the wife should be picking one up tomorrow when she is out around town tomorrow.

     Where is the starter, what does it look like, and how/why would it be filled with oil (I am assuming that if it is filled with oil that is a bad thing)???  I realize that I should wait until the cd that you are shipping me comes in, but I am trying to sell my other bike and want to get the V running as soon as possible.
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Lucky on May 18, 2006, 09:34:36 PM
the starter is on the bottom front of the engine, behind the ft exhaust pipes & below the radiator.

the nose of the starter sits inside the engine, below the oil level. there is a seal in the nose of the starter to keep oil out if the inside of the starter. yes, that's a bad thing. when the starter sits for a long time, the seal can stiffen up & leak, letting oil into the starter.

Yamaha decided to save 3 cents on the seal by not using one that has a spring in the lip of the seal.  the 'spring seal' is common & i believe some members here have some available.  rebuilding procedures are on my site. http://www.xz550.com/starters.html

--Lucky
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: MotorPlow on May 18, 2006, 09:52:10 PM
You need a 'starter rock' lol


He He He...
That's quite funny.
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: dj on May 18, 2006, 10:16:51 PM
lucky,

     it appears that the starter is sticking.  I put the tank back on and tapped on the starter a few times and it cranked right over.  Unfortunately I forgot to put one of the clamps on the fuel lines from the carbs and had to turn it off because gas was seeping out.  I put the clamp on tight and am letting the battery charge up somemore and then I'll put the tank back on and test it again.  It looks like I'll be tearing the starter out and fixing it.

     hopefully when I put the tank back on I wont notice anymore problems.  If I do then I'll be saying "hi" to all you guys sometime tonight or this weekend.  ;D
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: dj on May 18, 2006, 10:58:24 PM
All,

     It appears that I don't have the hoses routed right for the carbs.  I just notice a hose that is routing from the left side of the bike down over the engine and is beveled at the end that comes out the right side of the bike.  There is also a small hose hook up on the top right of the carbs that I can't find a hose to hook to it?!?

Lucky - does your site have a diagram of how all of the hoses hook from the tank to the carbs and from the carbs to other stuff.  There are 2 or 3 hoses that don't go to anything (there is a screw in the end with a clamp on them.  I don't have a clue what is going on here!  Please help.
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Lucky on May 18, 2006, 11:17:39 PM
There is also a small hose hook up on the top right of the carbs that I can't find a hose to hook to it?!?
this hosegoes to the airbox flapper hose. ir should have a small brass tube to hook them together. it's marked "to Airbox" in the pic below.
I just notice a hose that is routing from the left side of the bike down over the engine and is beveled at the end that comes out the right side of the bike. 
that hose connects to the plastic drain fitting on the front carb lower right side.  if the carbs overflow they drain below the bike. it's marked "bowl drain hose" below

(http://www.xz550.com/carbvac_page_files/vac_diagram.jpeg)
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Lucky on May 18, 2006, 11:21:37 PM
Pardon the poor pic, i made that a long time ago when i had just started learning 'paint', lol
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: dj on May 18, 2006, 11:32:07 PM
I'm gonna go check it out now.  It is pretty dark out right now, but I wont get another chance to check it out until saturday some time so hopefully the truck lights will make it bright enough for me to see what is going on with the hoses.
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Proteus on July 21, 2006, 02:26:07 PM
Holy crap. I was just looking through this post and decided to study the diagram. I just realized that my front intake has the petcock vacuum line and the rear intake is capped. Does this make a big difference?
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Night Vision on July 21, 2006, 03:47:17 PM
front intake has the petcock vacuum line and the rear intake is capped....

that's correct.... front is vac, rear is capped.

those ports on the intakes are used when syncing the carbs, you unhook the petcock vac line from the front one and turn the petcock to prime for gas and hook manometer to the front and rear intake ports
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Proteus on July 21, 2006, 04:39:02 PM
So I have it correct and Lucky's diagram has it backwards?
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Night Vision on July 21, 2006, 06:47:45 PM
hmmm, interesting question

the three bikes I've worked on, and yours would make at least four bikes that have front vac / rear capped. I think the Haynes shows the same

then again, if both carbs are sync'd they should be drawing same amount of vacuum, so I guess technically, it wouldn't matter...

swap them around and tell us if it makes a difference  :D

hey... you're not the one with less than 10 posts are you???  >:(
Title: Re: Bike wont start. Tried jumping the battery and it wont even turn over!
Post by: Lucky on July 21, 2006, 11:12:54 PM
my pic shows it backwards, but it makes no difference. nope, wasn't him...