http://home.usadatanet.net/%7Ejbplock/ISO5011/SPICER.htm
http://home.roadrunner.com/~jbplock/ISO5011/SPICER.htm
whoa.....makes me rethink the giant K&N cone on my car
I don't think K&N's are made to keep dirt out. They are made for maximum air flow. They only have the filter part to keep things like leaves and small trees out of the engine.
k&n filters are designed to let more air in. that means that smaller particles will go through the filter. now that said, after time the filter will "clog" up. this is not a bad thing. the filter will actually catch more dirt. it is recomanded that when you have a fresh filter (new or just cleaned) that you try to minimize the about of dust that you run through untill the filter has time to collect some dust.
i have one on all my trucks and on the fzr. i love them. when i clean one i will take it up and down a dirt road kicking up dust and sucking it into the intake. this kind of "seats" the filter. with my mudder i will actually take a small amount of dust off the garage floor and blow it into the filter to help it out. ive never had a problem with them allowing dirt to go into the carbs. and they will last alot longer than paper ones when they get wet. ive had then covered in mud before actually killing the engine. took them out rinsed them with a hose and reinstalled them and back through the mud i go. once back home ill give it a good cleaning and oiling and there like new again.
What a load of CRAP! Wonder why K&N is the filter of choice at the Baja races? When oiled and installed correctly, the K&N will not let you down.
I read this crap on the DB forums, but never thought I would see it here. JMO Tdub
Is it possible that the test was done with the UNI's and K&N's dry?! I agree with Tdub. I've been using K&N's on my cars for years. I make sure they're oiled well, and I've never had a problem. I even noticed a difference in how clean the intake system stayed post filter after I put K&N's in vs. the fram or whatever was in their before. With a fram filter, I sometimes would noticed that there was a faint, fine lining of dust on the intake parts after the filter. It was never bad, but it was still there. After puttin a K&N in, and cleaning everything up, everything seems to stay nice and shiny clean. Even after 50,000 miles or so.
Quote from: Tdub on June 27, 2006, 10:55:22 PM
What a load of CRAP! Wonder why K&N is the filter of choice at the Baja races? When oiled and installed correctly, the K&N will not let you down.
I read this crap on the DB forums, but never thought I would see it here. JMO Tdub
I think it's a fairly simple concept, to let more air in, you have to remove restriction. In remove restriction, you allow larger particles of dirt in. I have taken my K&N filter off to clean it and there is always a gritty oily residue around the inside of the filter box. I've never heard K&N ever claim their filters filter better than a paper filter. A member from another motorcycle forum emailed them to ask how well they filter compared to a paper filter, and they responded that they will filter with in 10% of a paper filter. As for using it in the BAJA 1000, we aren't talking about vehicles that have to last 100,000 miles. I also have seen foam pre filters installed.
With that said, I have a K&N on every thing I own. I use them because there is most likely some power gain and more importantly, I don’t have to buy another air filter. I think if they are going to do a test like this, they should do it on measurable engine wear over x miles. I've personally never heard of an engine croaking because it had a K&N on it.
What K&N filter is used on the Vision? (their web page only lists oil filter.)
Brian
I don't believe K&N makes an air filter for the Vision. The only aftermarket air filter I'm aware of is the UNI Filter oiled foam unit. I use the UNI & it seems to work just fine. I like the ability to reuse things whenever possible & cleaning / re-oiling the UNI air filter is a pretty easy thing to do.
H2O
I could never get the UNI to fit properly in the airbox and after a year the UNI simply fell apart. I have since gone back to paper and like it a lot better. If anyone want the UNI I had, they are welcome to it, I still have it in a box somewhere.
some one is using pod k&n filters on the vision but i belive they still are having problems getting them tuned right. i really need to get a new filter for mine. i still have the stock one on and its getting really dirty. im gonna work on something to get a k&n in the air box this winter.
why not take your stocker, gut it, and wrap a K&N around or inside of it?
I have the Uni, but that's the first I read about them falling apart.
h2o - how long you had yours?
ive seen the uni filters fall apart and get sucked in the carbs. my buddy had one do that in his dirt bike and he had just put it in that year.
i did think about gutting the stocker or just using one of the flat ones and modifying it. someone has directions for making a replacement our of one of the flat type. id have to check my files to see who did it. i figured it should work the same for the k&n.
or i figured since i dont have the flaper mod on my bike and it runs good that i should be able to run either one or two pods with out much trouble. ive been working on making a new air box for mine that would allow a pod to be dropped in. it got shoved in the closet but now ill have to dig it back out again and get somthing going.
Maybe someone could box up a stocker and fire it off to K&N, attn:Dennis and see what he can come up with???
I was simply going to go down to the auto motive store and find something close and start modifying the air box until it fit and I had a good seal.
Heh, I knew this would stir up some conversation.... ;)
Quote from: Tdub on June 27, 2006, 10:55:22 PM
What a load of CRAP! Wonder why K&N is the filter of choice at the Baja races? When oiled and installed correctly, the K&N will not let you down.
I read this crap on the DB forums, but never thought I would see it here. JMO Tdub
I don't agree with this at all, it is a valid ISO test on a specific product and I'm sure the results are accurate.
what it does
not say is that all brand x filters are bad, it states that there are differences for this specific application. I've used K&N Filters myself and find them to be fine where they're called for.
What I would not do is use them on my Toyota as I believe the stock filter is a superior to
any afermarket unit.
I am glad that I got everyone thinking about not paying attention to the marketing hype.
YMMV
-Ron
tdub i just may do that. well i will see if i have another stocker to spare first. i dont want to be without one.
I put over 50k on the K&N on my '87 Venture before cleaning it. In reality it could have gone far longer. I clean with simple green, rinse from the inside, let dry, re-oil. Bike still puts 93+hp to the road w/70k on it....had it dyno'd. The bike was only rated for 97hp. So I think it's still in good shape.
I don't agree with this at all, it is a valid ISO test on a specific product and I'm sure the results are accurate.
Sorry you don't agree Ron, but I will take THOUSANDS of race track(dirt) lap testing over an ISO test any day. I have always said that I would rather use something that works than a better deal or free. But, to each his own. I KNOW what works and what works well in this case. JMO Tdub
I have noticed that Big Trucks all use paper. It seams to me that the trucking industry would use what would be best, they,ve the most to gain or lose? Dave
Quote from: Tdub on June 30, 2006, 01:21:41 AM
I don't agree with this at all, it is a valid ISO test on a specific product and I'm sure the results are accurate.
Sorry you don't agree Ron, but I will take THOUSANDS of race track(dirt) lap testing over an ISO test any day. I have always said that I would rather use something that works than a better deal or free. But, to each his own. I KNOW what works and what works well in this case. JMO Tdub
removal of stock airbox for placement of a K&N cone on my dads car showed a 8hp gain on the dyno
of course, its supercharged..........
I did not read all the deatails. But the test mentions a restriction test due to dirt. At what point did they feel the filter was restricted? They say the K&N was restricted in 24 minutes. But I bet this restriction is based on virgin flow tests vs. pecentage lost during the test. Meaning since the K&N is the highest flow filter it is more likely to show a larger percentage of reduction in flow when you test it in severe conditions. BUT, what was it flowing at this so called"dust restricted level-unusable level?" Bet is was more than the others. I think this is a bit of suggestive number juggling. I did not see listed their criteria for an unuasable(clogged) filter! Lastly, I bet the dirt getting by is in the 5 micron range. Does anyone know how small 5 microns is ? If memory serves me...? TRY .005 of a millimeter which equals .0002" >>>>>>>>>>>I don't think that's going to hurt my engine. It hasn't yet.