Ok, i'm sick of this.

[Raj1988]

Why don't we look into adapting a petcock from a different machine. After all they are just Vacuum activated taps right? I am sure there must be something out there that has a similar spec with respect to the VAC pressure and sorta the same size. I am assuming here that doing metal work on the tank is not a big deal for someone with a welder and a lil bit of Know-how as compared to struggling over a tiny corroded Aluminium tap that leaks.

This is just an Theory of mine which i intend on following up on. Please do raise any issues you think i may need to pay heed to

[QBS]

I have test run my '83 using a pony tank and a blocked fuel return line.  On the test stand the bike appears to run as if the return line was allowed to drain into a catch can.  Perhaps it would be possible to run an '82 tank into a '83 set of carbs with blocked fuel return functions.  When I get my tank reinstalled as part of the current fuel system maintenance activity, I'll take the bike for a road test and close off the return line in line cut off valve and see what happens.  I doubt that it will run much different than with the valve open.  But...Stop and go traffic at 98 degrees F. might make a big diffence in driveability.  Legend has it that one of the big '83 carb improvements was a fuel recirculation system to cure a hot weather vapor lock problem that apparently '82s' could succumb to.

[fret not]

Today while shaking my tank with some chain inside to knock the rust loose, thoughts of rust prevention began to circulate in my imagination.  The main problem as I see it is the low areas that are lower than the petcock where water accumulates.  Has anyone tried cutting off the bottom edge of the tank (removing the low areas) and welding in a plate that would make the petcock the lowest spot?  What I'm suggesting would reduce the tank capacity by about a pint or so.

Since ethanol is in most of our gas we can pretty much count on getting some water in the tank.  If the petcock were the lowest spot in the tank the water would regularly be removed and thereby would not accumulate and cause rust.

Since my lumpy tank doesn't have any rust holes (yet) and I haven't seen other leaky Vision tanks my assumption is that the lower edge of the tank is where most everyone's tanks leak.  Is this correct?

[Lucky]

Jason, i've done just that, ran my 83 carbs off an 82 tank & blocked off the return. it worked fine, for about a season, then i located an 83 tank.

Raj & Fret, sure most things can be adapted, I made an oil cooler for my Touring Vision, and have rebuilt the 83 petcock, but these are not 'typical' or common repairs. anyone can solve these problems with enough knowlege & resources, so 'fixes' for them are not new ideas, but there are no 'bolt & go" solutions other than ta cut-off valve.

Inanecathode,
no problem on not wanting to go with my fix, it seems to work, but honestly i first did it to see if i could, & a few ppl have asked to have theirs done, so i did. i suppose if you wanted to keep the bike 'original' it's one way to go.  personally, i'd just throw a cut off valve on there & be on my way.

And for everyone:
As far as ethanol is concerned, it's a product knowlege deal.  It's an issue of neglect & ignorance more than anything else. Note that I use ignorance not as a negitive, to me it means lack of knowlege, not stupid.  I say this because of what I know.  Working on small engines every day, i see firsthand the problems ethanol can cause.  for most people it isn't an issue, & here's why:

What i deal with are mostly high quality pieces of equipment, used by professionals, & used frequently. we have E-10 here, & have for years.  Ethanol is hygroscopic, that is, it'll absorb water right from the air. left to sit long enough, water will collect in the tank (most anything with a tank has a vent)

for Example: if the tank of a 2 stroke chainsaw/weedeater/blower sits long enough, say sitting a season with a full tank, enough water will collect to get stired into the fuel as the machine is run. the machine may or may not run poorly because water doesn't burn.  the problem comes when that machine is then allowed to sit.  now you have water particals in the carb & the steel springs & needles, etc in the carb WILL RUST. Disolving gummed up gas is not a problem at this point, disolving rust is another matter.  2 stroke carbs have tiny passages (like ours) that if clogged with rust, are cheaper to replace than repair (i get $60/hour at work, & $30/h at home for labor)

Ethanol has now caused an expensive problem.

But, if the vehicle is run frequently, ethanol is less of a problem, the fuel is allways fresh and is used before it has time to draw water.

Now, there is one big difference between 2 stroke machines & bikes, cars, snowmobiles, etc.  the latter have metal tanks & since they tend to ALLWAYS have fuel in them, & the generally never have the fuel completely drained, so water can collect at the bottom of the tank & cause rust if it sits for long periods. If the vehicle tends to get filled before it gets low, & is used frequently (daily driver) any water accumulation is slight & probably will get sloshed around enough to get mixed in & pass straight thru the fuel system without a problem.

a couple of things to keep in mind:
--ethanol and infrequent use are a bad combination.
--'dewaterers' are basicly alcahol (sp) based & are realy intended to keep water already there from freezing the fuel lines in cold climates if used immediatly before freezing conditions occure. THERE IS NOT A PRODUCT ON THE MARKET THAT WILL BIND TO WATER BETTER THAN WATER. you can add these products to your tank, but they bind better to the gas than the water. the water WILL seperate out anyway.
--ethanol is mixed into the fuel at the tanker filling depot, not the refinery.  do not trust the calibration of those pumps.  I regularly test for ethanol content at my local stations, & the results are not what i would call consistant...
--count on E-15 to become law this August.

--Lucky

[jasonm.]

Lucky your observations are right on. You obviously come from the same "neck of the woods" as me.  Ya, RI is not far from CT.  If they go to E-15...kiss your simple lives behind. And expect to be flushing(not drive) your fuel system once a month and rebuild carbs once a year.   Maybe drain the tank and let it dry out at end of the season. Especially if you have more than one bike like me.  F**king corn growers and politicians can't sell enough to make food.

[inanecathode]

Lucky your observations are right on. You obviously come from the same "neck of the woods" as me.  Ya, RI is not far from CT.  If they go to E-15...kiss your simple lives behind. And expect to be flushing(not drive) your fuel system once a month and rebuild carbs once a year.   Maybe drain the tank and let it dry out at end of the season. Especially if you have more than one bike like me.  F**king corn growers and politicians can't sell enough to make food.

Once again, everyone in colorado has had the EVIL ETHANOL! for more than 20 years. Theres still motorcycles around here, and they have all the problems everyone else has. Theres not some huge carb shortage here, or tank shortage. I'll just say straight up, saying you have to rebuild your carbs once a year because theres alcohol in the fuel is just plain ignorant.

[Lucky]

inanecathode,

What i said, was that if your going to store anything with gas in it, that has ethanol, your better off removing the fuel unless you WANT water in the system next time you run it.

it doesn't take long to absorb enough water to produce rust.

and I said 'daily drivers' are not prone to these problems.

i haven't even mentioned that ethanol burns dirtier than straight gas, produces less power, or costs more to produce.  I understand the need to reduce our dependancy on oil imports, & for my cars that's fine, but not in my small engine equipment or bikes.

--Lucky

[inanecathode]

I'm sure the epa would love to hear why ethanol burns dirtier than gas, or more specifically mtbe. That's exactly why fuel in this state *has* ethanol in it. It doesnt cost more to produce, that's once again why they're using it. Its the cheapest most effective octane additive available right now. It has nothing to do with foreign oil. It's just one more thing we use that's basically "the best way to do it right now".

My dad's 'non' daily driver 1965 chevy caprice has sat for a decade in the same spot with that evil ethanol crap. No leaks, no problems whatsoever. In fact, it was started last spring with no problems.

[Night Vision]

it smells funny, mpg is lower, and produces less power...

piss me off 3 times, and you're not my friend

[jasonm.]

inanecathode,

What i said, was that if your going to store anything with gas in it, that has ethanol, your better off removing the fuel unless you WANT water in the system next time you run it.

it doesn't take long to absorb enough water to produce rust.

and I said 'daily drivers' are not prone to these problems.

i haven't even mentioned that ethanol burns dirtier than straight gas, produces less power, or costs more to produce.  I understand the need to reduce our dependancy on oil imports, & for my cars that's fine, but not in my small engine equipment or bikes.

--Lucky

Lucky could not have put it simpler. Something I have trouble doing. ME, having more than 1 bike. Which makes the sitting more common than those with only 1 bike. But again. It takes just a few hours in the summer for the water to accumulate.  I challange all who doubt me, to do the "glass test".

[Lucky]

MTBE isn't used anymore because it contaminates ground water, it has nothing to do with EPA...

[treedragon]

My solution for any water in the gas has been to add a serving of Methylated Spirits to the tank now and again, it raises the octane rating of the water somewhat.........

I tested some in a water/gas mix in a glass jar just to see what was happening in the tank.
If shaken the watered down meths emulsifies with the gas readily enough but in normal bike use I would say it just passes through the system, where it burns okay and just smells a tad odd.

[Re-Vision]

Found this interesting,two parts dealing with Henry Ford and Rudolf Diesel and bio-fuels.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGZEMwMx2vk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YR58dWGeBks