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Newsletter 8 online with info on a 750 Vision-based racer

Started by XZv2, May 24, 2007, 04:14:44 AM

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XZv2

ROV Newsletter number 8, the June 1987 number, is online at xz550.nl see 1984-87 Newsletters. NightVision, thanks for the scans you sent and for your help to read difficult sections.

This newsletter contains interesting info on a 750 cc Vision racer. It is a copy of an article published in Hot Bike of November 1985: an interview with Eddie Willbanks who built, with the help of many others, this interesting racer.
The article begins with a delightful euphemism: “the Yamaha 550 Vision, a vee-twin watercooled bike that just didn’t make it to the Top Ten in sales.” It continues: He (= Eddie) realized here was a “sleeper”, a bike that had real potential, and set his inspiration down on the drawing board, etc.
Some information on this road racer is in the article: the engine was bored and stroked to 750 cc (not mentioned are the actual bore and stroke, does anybody know??).
Mentioned are a 48 mm Weber downdraft carburetor (so one big carb was used, intake manifold was supplied by Ken Clark of Yamaha),
the cylinder heads were “one-off’s”, the weight was 330 lbs with oil, without gas, the rear wheel brake power was 87 hp @ 10.000 revs.
I have some questions:
does anybody know more of the history of this bike? Does it still exist? Other question: in the Newsletter are a number of photos, copied from Hot Bike. Those pictures show the special frame the bike has. Does anybody have an original copy of Hot Bike, November 1985 that can provide these photos in a better quality than those in the Newsletter?
XZv2 

supervision

   eurospares.com/wilvisn1.jpg       here's another project, eurospares.com/gsvisn1.jpg    there are also jpg's 2&3            eurospares.com is a site with many interesting pictures of projects and ideas, it takes hours to cover it    About that wilbanks bike, the Visionmeister and I were at Laguna Seca one year and that thing was their, sounded strong each time it was out their, but the guy droped it and  they didn't make the start of the race. Think it was running in Battle of the Twins, you could here it pulling against the Ducati's,in,practice ,down the start/finish straight, it was running FULL SONG !
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XZv2

Thank you, Supervision for the links: very interesting bikes. Difficult to see how the carburation is organized.
In Newsletter 8 the races at Laguna Seca and the Battle of the Twins are discussed, probably the '85 races.
Wonderful that you heard precisely that Willbank's bike running! I can believe it sounded strong: it had 87 hp at the rear wheel! Not bad 22 years ago.
XZv2


kiwibum

Any one else have info on the bore/stroke of this 750?

AMA129

The bore/stroke is 89.5mm by 60mm.
The carb is a Weber 48IDA(Twin choke, downdraft)
I have one of Eddie's 750s in my old roadracer that I bought from
Dean Joas after he won the 1986 AMA lightweight modified Pro Twins class in Battle of the Twins.
When I bought the bike it was 680cc(Standard 55mm crank with the 89.5mm bore)
I raced this bike in AMA/CCS for a few years ans then had Eddie build the engine to 750CC.
Job changes, etc forced me to give up racing the bike but I've still got the bike which hasn't been started
in a good 10 years.
It is a standard Vision frame with Cerriani 38mm Front forks, Fox rear shock, Dymag tz250 front wheel,
EPM 18" rear wheel and Spondon front brake calipers with large Kosman floating dics.

YellowJacket!

Now THAT is a cool first post for a new member!  ;D
Welcome to ROV and we'd love to hear more and see some pics.

David


Living the dream - I am now a Physician Assistant!!   :-)

kwells

...a vision is never complete.

www.wellsmoto.com

XZv2

Welcome to the board, AMA129!
Wonderful information you provide on this racer. Thanx for that.

The 89,5 mm pistons are mentioned in Newsletter 8 (that is: the 1985 Hot Bike article) as "some special TRW forging".
This suggests the pistons are "one-off's".
Do you know of any stock piston of that size fitting the Vision?
XZv2   

AMA129

The Pistons Eddie used in my bike were one off JE pistons.
The cams are Megacycle cams that used to be listed in their catalog.
The carb used on the 680 was a 44IDA Weber. Both the engines
had intake manifolds build by Eddie Wilbanks(Formed aluminum tubing
welded to an aluminum flange)

kiwibum

Welcome AMA129, nice to have you here. Does it have a specially built crankshaft for the 60mm stroke or was it out of something else and ground to fit?

Night Vision

Quote from: AMA129 on September 17, 2007, 12:11:39 PM
.....
I raced this bike in AMA/CCS for a few years ans then had Eddie build the engine to 750CC.
Job changes, etc forced me to give up racing the bike but I've still got the bike which hasn't been started
in a good 10 years
......
.....

that's long enough, dust her off and fire her up!....  ;D
if it ain't worth doing it the hard way....
it ain't worth doing it at all - Man Law
;D


if it ain't broke..... take it apart and find out why


don't give up.... don't ever give up - Jimmy Valvano

X-Vision

A VERY BIG WELCOME! Nice to have you with us AMA129. Where are you located? New, old and or current pics available?

AMA129

The 60mm crankshaft is custom that Wilbanks had built.
It's also got Carillo H-Beam rods in it to avoid a big end bearing
failure Eddie once had in his 1st bike. Other guys that ran 
Visions back in the 80's that I talked with never had any bearing
problems with their bikes though.
I'm in Florida at the present time. Jeff Swan came out to see the
bike when I lived in Arizona back in the 1990's.
I'll have to check to see if I've got pictures anywhere and try to post them..
The bike isn't very pretty right now, or else I'd take one of it now. I'm
thinking about putting it back together again though.

kiwibum

At some stage I'm going to look into what is involved in making a stroked cranksharft for these, it can't be too hard, V twin cranks are very simple. If Burt Monroe can make one out of a buldozer axel for his Indian, must be able to make one for the Vision ;D

89.5mm bore is quite a stretch from the original 80mm, was the cylinder re-sleeved to acheive that?

Any photos you have would be interesting to see. original, current and (eventually) restoration photos are always fun to review together.

pullshocks


supervision

  Hello AMA129! cool to hear your story!  I was at Laguna in the 80's and heard it go, happy to have you connect with us
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Rick G

Welcome to AMA 129. in 2000 or 2001  I had reason to call Jeff swan  and he gave  me the phone number  of a fellow  I don't remember his name, Sorry but my hard drive is full.  This fellow told me about three Vision road racers  with over sized pistons  (and, yes you not only have to resleve  the cylinders but also bore th spigot hole in the crank cases to get them to fit the cases)   and forged stroker cranks,  made locally . He still had the one bike in his show room. He said it made 92 hp .
I spoke to a fellow  who advertised on the forum , A racer from the Pacific north west  , who hae a set of JE pistons  with matching cylinders , he wanted to sell . we were moving and I could 'nt spare the money . I tried to email him later but the address was no longer valid , I sure wish  I had been able to get them.

kwells

I recently purchased 2 sets of oversized pistons, springs, and matched cylinders.  Have yet to get a caliper to post details though.  Also got a couple sets of race cams but also have yet to get the specs.
...a vision is never complete.

www.wellsmoto.com

jefferson

Hi Chuck,

Nice to see you are still out there and still have the race bike. How about we get the old girls going and make it to Mid Ohio for the vintage thing. That would be pretty neat.

Mine isn't far from raceworthy now, it is just the things I want to do before I race it again that is taking the time. I really want to get the 680 going so I would be more on par Horsepower wise with some of the bikes out there. It sounds like I need Carrillo rods as the 680 succumbed to a spun rod bearing as did one of the stock engines before that. I think most of the sanctioning bodies are allowing bikes of the Visions lineage 700cc.

I also have SRX wheels that I would like to get adapted. The fronts no problem and is on the bike now, but the rear needs to be converted to go on the shaft drive. I was going to send it to Eddie and have him do it. I really need to give Eddie a call as it has been quite awhile. I stopped in on my way to Barber at least a couple of years ago and he had the Vision flat tracker there trying to figure out the carb situation. From the results it sounds like it worked out pretty well.

Again really good to hear from you. Post away.

Jeff

AMA129

How's it going Jeff. Sorry, but I'm a bit too old and a way bit too heavy to get on that thing again. I think the last time I talked with Eddie, you just happened to be there. Hope everything is going OK with you and let me know if there's anything I can help with.
Yeah, rear wheels can be a pain. The EPM rear wheel on mine, I was told by Dean when I bought the bike, was like 1 of 5 made. The others went on SECA 750s that guys set up for track use back in the 1980s. I at times thought about getting the Aftermarket rear wheel for a V-Max as I think that it may work. There are also now more aftermarket V-Max wheels out there(http://vmaxoutlaw.com/tech/rear_wheel_alternatives.htm) lists some of them. It looks like a GSXR rear wheel can be modified to use the drive hub also.  I think Kosman will also widen a stock wheel.The drive shaft seems to be the limiting factor as far as wheel width goes(as well as Tire size). The one I have on the bike now is 4", but I'm sure 4.5 wouldn't be a problem. A 160 rear tire seems to be the limit, at least on my bike. A 6.00x4.00x18 slick is what I also used with no problems.  To get the 150 or 160 rear tire on mine required that the Driveshaft tube be bent in towards the drive shaft at the point where the widest part of the wheel hit the driveshaft tube on the swingarm.