Author Topic: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago  (Read 3738 times)

coldvision

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didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« on: May 29, 2007, 02:37:15 PM »
i just my bought my vision 3 days ago.  now i have some problems. when i found the bike, it had a dead batt.  so i jumped it  and it wanted to and did turn over. but it did something i never heard a bike do before. it sounded like the starter was just  spinning   it did not sound like it was hitting anything. as i said i never heard a noise like this.  i was wondering if maybe i have an oil leak  or missing a lot of teeth. i know one way to find out to just to pull it off and look for my self  but i ran into a lot of problems trying to do just that ( missing a lot of tools)   my ford hammer cant remove a starter.     oh yeah i almost forgot  i just called my local yamaha dealer  a new starter cost $699 plus freight.


more info on my V  '82    was sitting all winter in heated storage   it was laid down last summer and ran afterwards  (wasn't laid down that hard   only the flaring and footpeg damaged)  it has no visable rust anywhere (thank you  alaska!!)   and the only other  things that i saw wrong was the petcock  was clogged. and the pre. owner jerryriged the head light a little  all in all    pretty good shape  i think......
« Last Edit: May 29, 2007, 06:25:19 PM by coldvision »

dj

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2007, 02:57:18 PM »
Welcome to the forum.  Make sure to update your profile with your location as you might have some other visionaries in your area that can help you out in person.  We have several Vision owners that are spread out across the country with groups in TN, CO, CA, and a bunch in Canada.  Hopefully you are lucky enough to live by someone instead of like me and being the only member in Maine.  Poor me, no one to help me out for 100+ miles  :'( ;)


Let me guess you are hearing just a "whiring" sound coming from the bottom front of the engine (that is where the starter is)?  If I am correct at guessing what you are talking about then most likely your problem is your starter clutch is not engaging.  This is a comon problem with Vision, but once the fix is done you don't have to worry about it again.

PM Lucky (one of the senior members on the site who know just about everything about these bikes  ;D) and order his maintenance cd.  It has both the Yamaha service manual and the Haynes manual on it along with a parts fiche and lots of other good information about these bikes.  Then check out Lucky's site www.xz550.com and check out the starter clutch page.  Step by step instructions about how to get the starter clutch off the bike and how to do the fix.  It is a fairly easy fix, just make sure that you have the harmonic balancer or gear puller hooked up right or you will cause yourself some headaches (I learned this the hardway  :-[).

Don't worry about the getting a new starter, you can rebuild the starter on your bike for only a little bit of money.  Usually the problem with the starters is that the nose seal has allowed oil to leak into the starter and gums it up.  Very easy fix and you can change out the brushes while you are in there (if needed).  If the windings need to be repaired you can take it to an altenator shop and have it redone for $100 or less.

Make sure to get a good metric ratchet set and a set of metric allen wrenches (for taking the side covers off and a few other things).
« Last Edit: May 29, 2007, 03:00:04 PM by dj »
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kwells

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2007, 03:06:58 PM »
depends, it could also be the solenoid not engaging the starter motor to the flywheel

got a BFH?
...a vision is never complete.

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dj

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2007, 03:14:26 PM »
depends, it could also be the solenoid not engaging the starter motor to the flywheel

got a BFH?

I guessed the starter clutch because he said that
Quote
it sounded like the starter was just  spinning   it did not sound like it was hitting anything.

If it was the solenoid wouldn't it just making a clicking sound from the solenoid clicking on and off?
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kwells

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2007, 03:20:35 PM »
I would start by cleaning the connections.  Can bench test the starter but make sure you have a way to secure it or it will torque itself off the bench. Start with the starter and then work to the starter clutch since it's a bit easier that way.
...a vision is never complete.

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don_vanecek

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2007, 04:45:13 PM »
Oh my, factory starters are now up to almost $700.00!!!!

What more can you tell us more about the Vision you found. Do you know how long it may have been sitting around, covered or out in the weather, how many miles are on it?

 

dj

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2007, 04:50:22 PM »
I just checked his profile and he is located up in Alaska.  I think he will be in the same boat as me and not have anybody in his area to help him out in person.  Sounds like a fairly simple fix (starter or starter clutch).
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Scott_Mc

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2007, 10:42:36 PM »
I just checked his profile and he is located up in Alaska......

 :o  :o
Serious Rider!!  That explains his member name for sure ;)

Hang in there coldvision, you are in good (warm) hands :D!
Owned an `82 XZ for 22(?) years!
Current 2-`85 and 1-`86 GS1150E/ 1-`85 GS700ES
Wanted:-ST1300 :-O !!

kiawrench

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2007, 11:28:56 PM »
you guys just need to learn the tricks to buying electric bike parts-
 go to e-bay, vendor name a#1starterman, also listed as "14rebuilders" e-bay store.

 i have bought starter rebuild kits from them, great price, quick delivery. they also handle rebuilding for you, or get you a new one ,from oem specification. way cheaper than 700.00.
they can also get any electrical part we could ever need, you just have to ask.

 i got new generator armature, 20 percent of retail cost, still new in box, alternator for a friends boat, a new generator for a 1952 VW split window my brother in law owns ,and more. good prices, easy negotiations and the ability to fill the bill, good guys . and if something doesnt work right, they make it right !
keep your bike running,your beer cold ,and your passport handy.all are like money in the bank .

h2olawyer

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2007, 11:42:59 PM »
If coldvision ever needs to warm up, he can always use the frying stator!   ;D

Welcome to the forum, coldvision.  Looking forward to tales of 24 hour daylight rides!   8)  At least with your short riding season, you can make the most of each riding day.

H2O
If you have an accident on a motorcycle, it's always your fault. Tough call, but it has to be that way. You're in the right, and dead -on a bike. The principle is not to have any accident. If you're involved in an an accident, it's because you did not anticipate. Then, by default, you failed.

kwells

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2007, 11:47:09 PM »
insomnia ala vision style
...a vision is never complete.

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coldvision

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2007, 12:08:35 AM »
ok i have another question   many have said something about a stator   what is that  the only other bike ive owned was a kick start honda      and as for 24 hours of light    I LOVE WEARING MY SUNGLASSES AT 2 IN THE MORNING

kwells

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2007, 12:57:37 AM »
there are some that 'claim' to have stator issues.  They tell of stories outlining how they burn themselves into a crispy oblivion and cause electrical system failures.  I personally am not yet a believer of these Visionary myths that have spread forth as gospel.  But hey that's just me. 
...a vision is never complete.

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inanecathode

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #13 on: May 30, 2007, 01:09:57 AM »
i agree with kwells on this one :o!
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h2olawyer

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2007, 01:27:31 AM »
"I Wear My Sunglasses At Night" should be the official Alaska motorcyclist's theme song.   ;D

"And I wear my sunglasses at night
so I can
so I can
Keep track of the visions in my eyes."

As an owner who has fried three stators in three years (actually, a little less than that) I can attest that it is no myth.

The stator is the electrical generator for the bike.  Your kick start Honda probably had one as well.  there are several theories as to why they fail, but the consensus is they overheat.  The cause of the initial failure is still under some debate.  I think the two aftermarket ones I burned up in the last two years were faulty / poorly wound or insulated.

On the Vision, the stator is located behind the left side engine cover.  I now keep a spare stator on hand & have a Cometic gasket (reusable) so if this one goes, I can be up & running again in a few hours.  I have a used OEM stator in it now.  It charges steadier & the bike runs cooler than it did with either of the aftermarket units installed.  Many of us have installed a volt gauge or other charging system monitor to keep tabs on stator health.

Some owners have never had a problem, while others - like me - have had more than our share.

H2O
« Last Edit: May 30, 2007, 01:33:20 AM by h2olawyer »
If you have an accident on a motorcycle, it's always your fault. Tough call, but it has to be that way. You're in the right, and dead -on a bike. The principle is not to have any accident. If you're involved in an an accident, it's because you did not anticipate. Then, by default, you failed.

louthepou

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2007, 06:19:43 AM »
"I Wear My Sunglasses At Night" should be the official Alaska motorcyclist's theme song.   ;D

"And I wear my sunglasses at night
so I can
so I can
Keep track of the visions in my eyes."

As an owner who has fried three stators in three years (actually, a little less than that) I can attest that it is no myth.

The stator is the electrical generator for the bike.  Your kick start Honda probably had one as well.  H2O

Hey H2O, I didn't know you were a fan of Canadian pop rock artists of the 80's... :)

I'm willing to bet coldvision's Honda had a magneto, not a stator...  ;D

Anyways, hi there coldvision, and indeed, as you've probably figured out by now, members in here are the best source of info to get your Vision running. Be patient, and you will get the wanted results.

Weird noises when trying to start, aside than coming from the starter clutch, can also come from a loose balancer gear driving gear (located conveniently just behind the starter clutch). Both a bit of pain to fix, but worth the effort...

Cheers!

Lou
« Last Edit: May 30, 2007, 06:24:44 AM by louthepou »
Hi, my name is Louis, and I'm a Vision-o-holic

Tiger

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2007, 07:02:41 AM »
Weird noises when trying to start, aside than coming from the starter clutch, can also come from a loose balancer gear driving gear (located conveniently just behind the starter clutch). Both a bit of pain to fix, but worth the effort...
Cheers!
Lou

 ;)...Which means that when you remove the left side engine cover to remove the flywheel...to do the starter clutch repair, the 46mm nut is right there to be tightened before you re-install the flywheel...AND check your stator :o...and yes, I've blown two stators, (in less than a year), done the starter clutch repair/balancer nut on two of my '82 Vision's and have the cover off of my recently acquired '83 to replace the stator and do the necessary/obligatory starter clutch/balancer nut... ;)

In the two years that I have been a member of this "Family" I have acquired six Vision's... :o three of which where donor bikes and have helped others, (as well as me), to keep their "V"s up and running... 8)

"Hooked", you may say..."Hell YES" say I..."and proud of it" 8)

Oh, and welcome to the ROV "Family"...THEE only place for a "V" and its "keeper"... ;D :D :D :D :D :D... ;)

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Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming HOOOOYA lets go again baby !!!!!!

'82 Vision, Pearl Orange finish, lots of up-grades!!!

Lucky

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2007, 08:20:58 AM »
not wanting to sound ignorant, i know it warms up in Alaska, but Visions are cold blodded, they like nothing more than to sun themselves in a nice warm driveway. 

go with a lighter weight (10/20-W40) for cooler temps, anything under 55 degrees.  Too thick of an oil will allow the starter clutch to freewheel at times.  avoid automotive oils with friction modifiers, they will mess with your clutch plates.

if it just plain freewheels all the time, then you'll have to do the starter clutch mod.

can you bump start it?

--Lucky
1982/3 XZ550 Touring Vison, Gold on Black

coldvision

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2007, 11:40:26 AM »
yes it does warm up here it gets to any where  around 65-95 all summer,,, day and ..well..night     as for the colder temps  everyone seems to run 5-w30 in the winter  but while snow flies  my little v will spend winters in a heated garage     

it does not freewheel all the time   it does engage but not for very long  and as for bump start not at this time she is about a dozen pieces      tonight i am getting the tools i need to pull the starter and (hopefully) rebuild it  i guess it helps that i work at napa as tools and hardware are right there as i leave        although i don't know where to get a new/OEM stator  i could try my yama dealer but they don't carry old bike parts   

    thanks for all the help and support

h2olawyer

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Re: didnt know what a vision was 4 days ago
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2007, 12:15:16 PM »
You will need to get it running to see if you need a stator or R/R (regulator / rectifier).  OEM stators are still available from Yamaha (expensive - like $300+).  Occasionally come up used on eBay (questionable if they're any good).  Aftermarket sources - Electrosport, Ricks & one out of Canada who sells on eBay - all around $130.  Also Tim Parrott Enterprises - under $100 & occasionally sells on eBay as well.

lou - As for music tastes - call me eclectic.  Listening to '40s on 4 (XM radio available on satellite TV) at the moment - big band stuff.  Like about anything except that hippity hop / rap crap.  I even listen to the occasional opera!  Current favorite, however, is bluegrass / newgrass.  The Seldom Scene, New Grass Revival, Bela Fleck, Alison Krauss & Union Station, Ricky Skaggs, Del McCoury, Rhonda Vincent & The Rage, stuff like that.

H2O
If you have an accident on a motorcycle, it's always your fault. Tough call, but it has to be that way. You're in the right, and dead -on a bike. The principle is not to have any accident. If you're involved in an an accident, it's because you did not anticipate. Then, by default, you failed.