Starter Seals Again

[mastergunny]

Let me ask one more time as my mechanic said he rebuilt the starter this weekend but says he cannot find any "nose O ring to engine" seal.

He states he has found about four size options and has some seals ordered and thinks one of them should work.

I think you guys tried to make me smart on the seals but I am not sure which he is talking about.

Matt

[Lucky]

the nose to engine o-ring is metric

the square cut body seals are hard to find, but they're mostly dust seals & silicone sealer will work in a pinch.

--Lucky

[Aelwulf]

If he's talking about the nose seal my guess would be the Chicago one.  Part number is something like CR 7913 (think two of the numbers are off there).  Do a search for Chicago and you'll probably get a thread or two with the part number.  $5 each at NAPA (although probably special order, so $5 shipping with it).

[Night Vision]

I think he's talking about the oring that goes on the outside of the starter nose so when you put the starter into the case, you don't leak oil..  its about 45mm best I can tell and 1mm, 1.5mm? wide

[Rick G]

I wasen't able to find  a source , in this one horse town, other than the local HD dealer ( their holding Honda and Yamaha hostage)   YIC gets 14.00 each for them!!!

[mastergunny]

Rick, any partnumber of what you get at HD???  that costs $14.00?

[Night Vision]

google metric o-rings... you can buy 250 of them for $0.05ea.

[Rick G]

Thats a good idea night.
Gunny, I'll get the number tomorrow.

[mastergunny]

"google metric o-rings... you can buy 250 of them for $0.05ea." If I knew what to google for I would. SIZE? Any other info that would help me google.
I appreciate all the help the site and you all provide, but frankly I have received a lot of info about the o'rings, but nothing to help me find them.

 
Insert Quote
I wasen't able to find  a source , in this one horse town, other than the local HD dealer ( their holding Honda and Yamaha hostage)   YIC gets 14.00 each for them!!!   Ok $14.oo for what???????????????

I think he's talking about the oring that goes on the outside of the starter nose so when you put the starter into the case, you don't leak oil..  its about 45mm best I can tell and 1mm, 1.5mm? wide.  Ok, now I think we are getting close to something I can google.

If he's talking about the nose seal my guess would be the Chicago one.  Part number is something like CR 7913 (think two of the numbers are off there).  Do a search for Chicago and you'll probably get a thread or two with the part number.  $5 each at NAPA (although probably special order, so $5 shipping with it).  I will try this one assuming Chicago is Chicago Rawhide??

Boy it would be nice if the actual bike drawings were available so you could just check the drawing for the correct part number! I do thank you all. I am just hoping I can get the seals.

[mastergunny]

Does this look right??

http://www.skfextranet.com/Catalogs/457010/sealdetail.asp?s=7913

[Night Vision]

kinda

that is almost like the starter nose seal, but not what we use... it doesn't have a spring for the lip... NAPA OIL SEAL #SOMETHING SOMETHING 7913

I still don't know if you're look for a nose SEAL or nose O-RING  ???

sorry I can't measure a flimsy used o-ring off a beat starter closer than about 45mmx1.5mm

http://www.oringswest.com/

[h2olawyer]

That's close, but here are the seal dimensions to look for:  20x35x5  (in millimeters).  Hard to find the 5mm width, but a 6mm will work fine and I used a 7mm - it was very tight getting it back together, but it did fit.  Others have had troubles getting the 7mm to work.

Here's the one:  www.skfextranet.com/catalogs/457010/sealdetail.asp?s=563019

Spent some time figuring out how to get to the construction / lip style on their website.  This is the closest one to the original - but with a stainless steel spring added - as I could find.

This is the seal that goes inside the nose of the starter - not the o-ring that seals the gap between the starter & engine case.

For anyone interested, this is the new place to find Chicago Rawhide seals.  When searching for Chicago Rawhide, you will end up @ SKF.

H₂O

[mastergunny]

Here's the story, I was offered a couple of visions and a bunch of parts from a fellow Venturer (as in Yamaha Venture). I have an 06 Venture and was looking for a good 'round town' bike and a good bike for my son to learn on. Anyway I live in Ellettsville, IN and the bikes are in Cincinatti. My buddy took the bike and a couple of starters over to Buckeye Performance  (http://www.buckeyeperformance.com/) so the owner (Rick Haverkamph) can get the old girl running. He called me and said he was having trouble locating a "nose O ring to engine" seal.

I guess without a picture it is impossible to know what he is talking about. A maintenance manual should call out the proper nomenclature for the seal he is talking about. Sometimes seals, O'rings and Packings, can all mean the same or something very different. I would love to have the blueprints to the bike so you could get real dimensions for these types of things and go find a source for them. Rick said once he locates the proper item, he will let me know so I can post it here and then all the ROV's can get them from him!

He does a lot of business in the bike repair and custom manufactures replacement brake and clutch stainless steel lines etc.

The offer from my friend was too much to pass up. Actually it is two bikes that should be able to get in running order easily, also there are  two carcass bikes and a bunch of parts.  I think Rick said he was going to go ahead and redo the fork seals while he is waiting for the starter options.

Anyway, will keep everyone posted on the progress. There are times when I am thinking it is nuts to have a bike you can't get OEM parts for!

But I guess that is just part of the challenge of keeping a classic running. Thanks H2O, I will send him the info on 20x35x5  (in millimeters).   Matt

[h2olawyer]

Glad to help, but those dimensions are for the internal seal - not the starter to engine interface.  The internal seal should be replaced to make sure oil from the engine doesn't enter the starter.  The O-ring keeps the oil from leaking to the outside world between the starter & engine.  (hope that helps clear up the issue a little bit, anyway)

H₂O

[mastergunny]

Thanks that helps. Is the internal seal you mention a 'garloc' type seal and not an o'ring? I am getting the pictue now that the starter to engine seal is an o'ring and the seal you mention that keeps oil out of the starter is different.

It will help when I get the bikes here and can work on them myself. Rick is trying to make sure they are in running condition befor I bother to go get them.

Later do we have the ability to post pictures in our threads should I have a question?

[h2olawyer]

The internal seal is a small version of the type of seals  used in forks, automotive axles - where sliding or rotating shafts are present.  It has a metal 'frame' that gets press-fit into place & has either one or two lips on the sealing surface & a spring to hold the seal tight to the shaft.  The exterior one on the starter is only an o-ring.

To post photos, you need to have an outside account with someone like photobucket or your own webpage.  Then you can link to it from your post, using the insert image button above the emoticons.

Hope this helps.

H₂O