A new rider...

[J-Et.]

Hy,

I'm french so sorry but my english is not very good, mostly for the mechanical words.... (when google translate for me, i put "" on the text.)

My girl friend father had a XZ550 an he tell me last week that he is ready to give me the bike if I'm able to repair it.  :D
(I'm currently working to get my bike license because I can't ride with my car driving license, So I like to repair the bike during that time and be ready to use it as an every day bike when i've got my licence)
I never see clearly the bike yet because there are many.... things.... all around in the garage but it look like this one


He tell me the matter with the bike is "distribution chain".    
He was "stalling the engine" a first time and then the engine won't sart again. So, back to home, he "adjust the distribution chain" and start again.
A fiew time later that happen again and then the engine never start again. When he try to go to yamaha the mechanic tell him : no way i never see this engine before ! do it your self. :-\
This append many years ago maybe between 1990 and 1994 (he don't remind exactly).
I forgot to telle the bike was a second hand. And he don't remind exactly of much Km as the bike. he just tell me : not too much, i have to take a look...

So i'm looking for information and i hope help to repair this nice bike !
Of course next time I go to his home I will look for more information and details and take some pictures of the bike. (he is leaving in 150km from me and my job don't let me a lot of free time so I probably can't go there before one or two weeks)

The only engine I repair in the past is a Vespa ACMA 1955 (125cc) but the engine is much more simple ;)


I hope my english was not too bad and my text not too long....
Thanks for your help and advises !  ;)

J-Et.

[YellowJacket!]

Hello J-Et.

My guess from the translation is that the "distribution chain"  is the stator, or charging system on the bike.  It is a common problem - more so for others than some.
The second thought is that it could be the coils that supply the spark to the spark plugs.  If it only runs on one cylinder, that is the most likely problem and is usually easy to fix.
The Vision is a great bike and you came to the right place to ask you questions and hopefully find your answers.  It may take a little time and some conversation back and forths but we are here to help you and wnat you to be able to enjoy your new bike.

Welcome to the Riders of Vision family!

David

[J-Et.]

Hello David
Thank your for the friendly answer !
I hope i well understand everything you said.

I think there is a misunderstand. I not mean the stator but he chain who made the valve open/close (going from the "crankshaft"  to the valve    
axis).  so the valve don't open on the right time. I'll take a look for a model of the engine, i will show you.
But I don't knew if it's really the matter, that's what Philippe (the bike owner) tell me about the bike and he is not a mechanic.

I hope you'r right. I prefer a common -easy to fix- trouble than a hard unknown mechanical trouble....
Could you tell me what to look next time I see the bike to get a right idea of the problem ?
I also can ask Philippe for more details because i can't go to Philippe's home before two weeks.

J-Et.

PS : I need to by a english dictionary to find the good technical words, google translate is not as good as i was thinking....

[Brian Moffet]

If you can, please include the actual French words along with the translation.  While my French is extremely old, last time I spoke French, many people on the forum were not yet alive, others are much better at it  :)

Brian

[67GTO]

I like your Vespa :)

[blimp]

me too! 

I have 2 vespa and my vision.   At least ONE of them is usually running!

Both my vespa are smallframes, one 125 ET3 and one P125ETS

[YellowJacket!]

Any of our Canadian friends up there speak french?

David

[vadasz1]

I thind 'Lou the Pou' would be your best bet for Francais parlez.....

[Tiger]

 :)...and French Canadians speak a bastardised form of 17th century French!!!

Bonjour J-Et...bienvenue 8)

Contact "Lucky"...he has a great CD which contains workshop and parts manuals as well as a lot of helpfull hints and tips to help you repair/maintain a Yamaha Vision/XZ550... 8)

There are two superb XZ550 owners clubs, one in Germany and one in Holland, which would be of help to you also, especially for parts. I'm sure somebody here will have the website address (es)... :-\

The Vision in North America lasted two years, 1982/1983, and have one or two differences to the rest of the world!!! However in Europe it was available as the XZ550 from 1980/1 to 1985 'ish...

Please do not worry about your English (which is good) or the length of your text...We are all here to help you to get the very best from your newly acquired ride mon ami... 8)

                 8).......TIGER....... 8)

[J-Et.]

Hy - Salut !
Thank to all ! - Merci à tous !

- Canadian French is french ? ???  It's a joke of course  ;D I've some friends in canada I don't ave think to ask them for translation...
But there are many diferences between french and canadian. For exemple "gosses" what mean in french child mean in canadian french balls...  ;D

- I also do like my Vespa ;) but I can't ride very often because in Paris this kind of very old Vespa's are very often stolen so I don't use it for job. It's on my parents home so I only ride for holidays....

- Thank's to the compliment about my english. As i can see you understand what I said, it's good for me !

- I think it's no more useful to write in english and french or use google because Philippe tell me yesterday he as the Mechanic book for the bike who is in french and english ! (that's a very good news)
So, I will find easily my words as soon as i get the book next week-end.
He should tell me soon what kind of XZ it is (81 or 85 ?....) he just need some time to find the papers of the bike... somewhere in the home....

I think i will wait to see the bike in details before i gonna ask "Lucky" or anyone for too much help. Because I actually don't know so much what to ask.... As you see, I really no sure of the mechanic trouble yet.

[J-Et.]

I forgot some thing....
I find on the internet a picture of the engine. I've colored in red the "chaine de distribution" If some one could tell me the english name...
And if it realy could be the matter or if YellowJacket is probably right when he spoke of an startor problem.

I know, i said five minutes ago no more questions yet... ;D

[h2olawyer]

Welcome!

The "chaine de distribution" wou are asking about is the "camshaft chain".  Actually, camshaft chains as there is one for each cylinder.

Don't worry about your English - it's most assuredly better than my French!  I used to be fairly fluent in Spanish when I was in high school and I had a year of Russian in college, but both of those were many years ago.  I barely remember any Russian and I can understand maybe 20% of any conversation I hear in Spanish.

Again, welcome to our virtual family!

H₂O

[Rick G]

Hi J-Et,  I had a 180 cc Vespa in 1966 it was  a hoot!  It was legal to use on the freeway in Los Angeles  and performed amazingly well.

Cam chain problems on the XZ550 are extremely rare and the adjustment is automatic, (not manually adjusted.) Be sure to keep us posted on your progress.
Your English is fine , much better than my "cereal box " French.  I was born in Montreal,  but  I am of the English speaking minority. We moved west when I was very small so I really know  a lot more Spanish than French.
Where is Bernard La Jois (French the Wrench) when you need him!

[J-Et.]

Hi everybody !

I'm very happy to find this forum where every one is so friendly !! (It's not always like that...)
Tank to H2o for the translation !
Thank's Rick, what you said is a good news. In France to drive a bike from 50cc to 125cc you need the car driving license and the motorbike driving license for the uppers 125cc ones. ( and for the young -just a bit younger than me- you need a license for the 0 to 50cc)
The last time I drive the vespa a man stop his speed triple and ask me to take a ride withe the vespa (he propose me to take ride with the street !!! But i do not of course... need the licence... if only... but he was happy the drive the Vespa.)

For the week-end i will phone Philippe to get as much details and information as i can get to the bike. (helped by every thing you teach me about the engine)
My other problem is yet to find a place to repair the bike in Paris otherwise, i have to repair it in Orleans so it will be very long... But anyway i will probably not get my license before at last tree or for month... (I hope less  ;) )

Be sure i will give step by step informations about my workshop....

J-Et.

[Coil Coyle]

J-Et,

        A Service Manual or Lucky's CD will show you the correct timing of the camshaft sprockets and chains.

        A simple test of the chains is "Compression Test". If the cylinders have compression in specification then the cam chains are not the first thing to check.

Use a tool like this http://www.2carpros.com/dia/how_to_check_compression.htm

Please write and tell us what you learn.

$0.02
;)
Coil

[Rick G]

J-Et, reading your posts is delightful, you accent comes right through. It reminds me of my trips home to Quebec.
Ask any questions you  want , we are all here to help! ;) ;D

[J-Et.]

Hi,
Finely america like the frog accent  ;)

The bike is from the 20 07 1982. I think in english you said 07 20 1982. Philippe by the bike in 1990 an don't use it more than one or one and a half year because of the supposed camshaft trouble. On the papers the "type : 11U" and the "série : 1243" (I don't know exactly what it is in french so translate yourself  ::) )

Philippe is sure it's the camshaft chain. Me not yet... And I think he is hesitating to let me try to repair the bike because he's not sure i will be able to do it.  :-\ I understand he don't want i spend time and money and then made the engine worst than he actually is.
For being honest, I'm not sure too (never repair a 4-stroke engine) but I like to try... Wen I repair the Vespa engine it was my first mechanic job. (but a friend helped me and he can't help me now because he gonna leave in Canada soon) So I think we will have a long dialog next week-end...
I think it's possible to repair the bike for two reason. First, we have the Service Manual. Next, Help on the internet (people use to repair this engine, I mean you  ;) ).
Anyway i will do like i gonna repair the bike and i tell you next week-end what append.

Thank's Coil for the useful link. I have a technical question for the compression check.
Could I check manually ? I mean on the vespa, I can use the "kick" (not find the translation) to move the piston and check the compression. On the Bike is that possible to check like that ? Because then it will be possible to made a quick check. If i have to "restart" the bike it will be much longer (buy a new battery, check the fuse, ...) If there is some stator trouble, could I check the compression ?...
I find no information about that on the internet.
Other question if I buy a compression tester is that some specifics ones for the motor bikes or is that the same for all bikes and cars ?

J-Et.

[J-Et.]

During the lunch I found some more information on the internet.
I read this : " you need to check the compression on a warm engine otherwise the values are wrong." on all the websites i read (french and english)
So my question is how to check if the engine don't start ?
(I knew it's maybe a crazy question... but google wasn't my friend that time...)

[YellowJacket!]

Hello J-ET
A little history about many of the members on this site:  Most of us obtained our bikes after they had "sat outside, neglected for many years - mine sat outside and had not run for 12 years".

Many of us have never restored a motorcycle before and these were our first projects.  Mine was, at least.

The information you will get here is priceless and always friendly.  Like you said, you don't comeacross that on many website forums these days.  Oh, and your English is great.

The first thing I did when I got my Vision was to remove the spark plugs and put a few CC's of oild into the cylinders and let it sit.  There is also a small acces cover on the right side engine cover.  If you remove the small round cover - which is right by the foot pad on the brake pedal - you will see a large bolt.  You can use a large socket to turn that bolt and the cylinders will move.  Its a great way to lubricate the pistons and cylinders for a bike that has not been running for a while.  It worked for mine.

Like some of the other members said, timing issues for the Vision are quite rare.  It is possible thoughh that it may have been revved too  high (run at high RPM's) and a valve may have been damaged.  But that is not very likely.

Take Care,

David

[J-Et.]

Thank for the advise David. Be sure i will do that.
No one said anything about my idea to use this bike for every day. So I suppose it's not a bad idea. What you think ?
J-Et.